The Conclave

The Ordos Majoris - Hobby, Painting and Modelling => The Dark Millennium => Topic started by: 0604854 on June 30, 2012, 11:57:47 AM

Title: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: 0604854 on June 30, 2012, 11:57:47 AM
Will update you on new fluff...
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Charax on June 30, 2012, 11:58:43 AM
one of the big ones: Squats are back!
that, and we get a new bunch of abhumans - Fishmen, Catpeople, Neandors and treepeople
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Dolnikan on June 30, 2012, 01:16:51 PM
That sounds very interresting. I'm very curious to see what else is there.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Shannow on June 30, 2012, 04:16:48 PM
that, and we get a new bunch of abhumans - Fishmen, Catpeople, Neandors and treepeople

Have to say they sound like ideas generated by a 14 year old in an english literature class imo


EDIT: not to say that these ideas can't be done well (as dapper as pointed out), it just sounds a little like GW have gone

"Oh how can we make this more interesting?"

and then developed a venn diagram of what can you combine humans with to make not quite humans.

again just my opinion and it may be done very well, I shall remain sceptical :P
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: DapperAnarchist on June 30, 2012, 04:36:22 PM
Fishmen - totally Deep Ones. And therefore awesome. Shadow Over Innsmouth and Thing on the Doorstep are two of Lovecraft's best.

Neandors - potentially interesting idea, wonder what was meant. Can anyone translate the latin/greek? Are these supposed to be Neanderthal "regressions"?

Catpeople - the latin name just means hairy, and the "Gothic" name is "Felinid", so could just be a very hairy human? Or perhaps something more monkey like, less catgirl? Though I think that the Catperson concept can be good - read the Instrumentality stories for some interesting catpeople.

Treepeople - I'm seeing this as less dryads, more as gene-engineered survivors with symbiotic plant life, similar to Orks... If anyone has read the Book of the New Sun, like the Green Man that Severian meets in the circus, like that.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Charax on June 30, 2012, 04:59:55 PM
See, the Neandors are interesting. First thing that leapt to mind was Neanderthals, and Robey agreed, but technically Neanderthal comes from New Man, and the New Men were the Sensei - who would, technically speaking, be Abhumans. Rebecca looked into some of the greek and came up with a bunch of possible meanings that leant that way.

and being GW, either's possible. I kind of like the nod to Sensei.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Holiad on June 30, 2012, 06:45:43 PM
Personally, I don't feel that a name on a list of "known abhumans" even comes close to "squats are back".  Is there any actual information about them, such as their prevalent culture, level of technology, or even their relations to the other races, which I *wouldn't* expect to include a friendly relationship with the imperium.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Dolnikan on June 30, 2012, 07:03:24 PM
It depends, to be classified as abhumans a group would need a friendly attitude, otherwise they would just get lumped in with the 'xenos scum which are to be exterminated.'

At least there are vague references again, meaning lots of speculation and perhaps even some nice modelling ideas.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Glorioski on July 02, 2012, 02:31:58 PM
Personally, I don't feel that a name on a list of "known abhumans" even comes close to "squats are back".

It's the first time the name Squats has been mentioned in a GW publication since the nineties. In the sense that until now GW had written them out of the fluff almost entirely (they even edited books to remove references to them), they are certainly back.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Macabre on July 02, 2012, 02:55:04 PM
Rebecca looked into some of the greek and came up with a bunch of possible meanings that leant that way.

Oooh, I've been mentioned ^_^

Yes, Neandor is archaic Greek for 'New Man', and whilst I couldn't find any links to hyannothus (or any direct derivation), broken down, the latin roots suggest it means either 'These do not exist' or 'these are the new age'.

But then again it could just be GW making up words again.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Charax on July 02, 2012, 03:43:23 PM
Personally, I don't feel that a name on a list of "known abhumans" even comes close to "squats are back".

It's the first time the name Squats has been mentioned in a GW publication since the nineties. In the sense that until now GW had written them out of the fluff almost entirely (they even edited books to remove references to them), they are certainly back.

It wasn't quite THAT bad, they edited one reference, added a line to mention the Tyranids and started referring to them as Abhumans rather than Squats. They've been mentioned a few times, just not in a "HEY, THESE ARE SQUATS! LOOK HERE!" way
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: DapperAnarchist on July 02, 2012, 05:01:24 PM
Like the short "Outremer" soldiers mentioned in Legion (though that's Horus Heresy, so might not count) and I think Golgotha was described as an abhuman world in some 3rd edition material, perhaps after the 3rd War for Armageddon campaign...

GW's staff seems to include some pretty smart people (or at least as smart as some of their more clued in fans, as they probably were clued in fans before), so it's quite possible "hyannothus" means both of those, in a punning way. Like More's probably-intentional misspelling of "Utopia".
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Dolnikan on July 02, 2012, 05:17:45 PM
Just a small question, but are there any other changes? Did the tau thing really happen?
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Glorioski on July 02, 2012, 05:39:15 PM
Just a small question, but are there any other changes? Did the tau thing really happen?

No the Tau thing isn't in there. That rumour appears to have been false conjecture drawn purely from the allies matrix.

It's actually a really well written book. Background section is full of little tidbits, I'll see if I can post a few when I've read more.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Dolnikan on July 02, 2012, 05:47:02 PM
Thank goodness that it wasn't true. I really feared that they would have done that.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Shannow on July 02, 2012, 07:00:46 PM
Amen!
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Koval on July 02, 2012, 07:09:50 PM
They wouldn't have done that even if they were on some really good weed. Quoth my local blackshirt, "they're not going to tear down a huge chunk of existing background, especially when it involves Space Marines, when there's been so much time spent updating the background to be more consistent with Black Library".

Asking a blueshirt and the local gamers around the painting table today revealed that it was all bunkum anyway. :P


Re. Squats, they've been alluded to in Codex: Orks as well (though that one's often overlooked for some reason), and the novel Gunheads (which gets extra bonus points firstly for being written by Steve Parker*, and secondly for being set on Golgotha) has quite a long sequence in which the Imperial army has to cut through what can only be an ancient Squat stronghold -- notably, the Adeptus Mechanicus delegation ends up going walkies, which leads to the architecture being described in quite some detail.

About the book itself -- the Special Rules section strikes me as something that might fit nicely into a 40KRP core rulebook, as the layout feels so similar to how weapon qualities, Skills, Talents, and Traits are laid out.

*The fact that Parker isn't one of the most well-known Black Library figures probably leads to Gunheads being overlooked, but I like his writing style. It's descriptive enough without being too showy-offy.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Knobby2 on July 02, 2012, 08:24:22 PM
slightly off topic, as for squats coming back the orignal fluff if i remember correctly had them in strongholds and were miners as well as being advanced,

anyone notice what little bit about the demiurg exists says the same
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Koval on July 02, 2012, 08:42:22 PM
That's been noticed for quite a while, although IIRC Jervis said there was more to it than simply recycling Squats as Demiurg. Could be wrong on that count, though, I've forgotten most of the Jervis thing.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Knobby2 on July 02, 2012, 09:07:14 PM
if the demiurg are not recycled squats, and IMHO they arent squats, I'd like too see a bit more about them aswell as the niscar
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Macabre on July 02, 2012, 09:15:42 PM
if the demiurg are not recycled squats, and IMHO they arent squats, I'd like too see a bit more about them aswell as the niscar

The Nicassar

(http://images.wikia.com/warhammer40k/images/c/c7/Nicassar.jpg)
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Glorioski on July 02, 2012, 09:20:00 PM
if the demiurg are not recycled squats, and IMHO they arent squats, I'd like too see a bit more about them aswell as the niscar

The demiurg are in the new Primarchs compilation in the Alpha Legion story. They are described explicitly as xenos who are chiefly miners and traders.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Charax on July 02, 2012, 09:32:57 PM
the Demiurg are the squat archetype recycled, in that they're short, antisocial miners - that's not the same as just being "the squats recycled"
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Glorioski on July 04, 2012, 08:50:58 PM
[
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Inquisitor Goldeneye on July 04, 2012, 08:55:20 PM
Did somebody say 'Fishmen' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3tTHn2tHhcI&feature=player_detailpage)?

Right, now that's out of the way:

I'm relieved to hear all that business with Space Marines and Tau becoming hugsy-wugsy most bestest buddys evar was just a rumor, and the new abhuman races sound interesting (especially the tree people).

Also;
The Nicassar

(http://images.wikia.com/warhammer40k/images/c/c7/Nicassar.jpg)

Could some kindly soul please explian to me just what the nutty-fudgekins this thing is?!
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: greenstuff_gav on July 04, 2012, 09:02:25 PM
I'm relieved to hear all that business with Space Marines and Tau becoming hugsy-wugsy most bestest buddys evar was just a rumor, and the new abhuman races sound interesting (especially the tree people).

Tau Ally with everyone (http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m64sceqMUN1rqnhowo1_1280.jpg) .. Brothers In Arms with Space Marines  so can intermingle characters etc...
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Shannow on July 04, 2012, 09:36:42 PM
Erm, possibly an ill educated question, but I would have thought that the Necrons, like the tyrannids wouldn't ally with anyone either, I mean sure they might happen to have the same aims, but surely this is pure coincidence rather than a reasoned 'lets work together for now' sort of thing? Or this there fluff of necrons working with other races?

Kindly educate me please!
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Koval on July 04, 2012, 09:55:40 PM
They've ... shall we say, fought on the same battlefield as the Blood Angels against a mutual enemy before. Apparently, the Silent King was quite the fan of his codes of honour since he declined to massacre the Blood Angels thereafter.

I therefore interpret it as "we have a mutual enemy, so while they're still here, don't screw with us and we won't screw with you"
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Heroka Vendile on July 04, 2012, 11:23:36 PM
Tau Ally with everyone (http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m64sceqMUN1rqnhowo1_1280.jpg) .. Brothers In Arms with Space Marines  so can intermingle characters etc...
oh good, people have started making usable versions of that hideous chart in the rulebook.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Akuro Adenn on July 05, 2012, 05:13:09 AM
Hopefully all bodes well within the fluff. I'm not too terribly concerned with the rules at this point- I don't think I'll be playing full 40k. Too much hassle, and never enough money on my end.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: DapperAnarchist on July 05, 2012, 04:07:58 PM
The giant bear thing is the product of a joke Gav Thorpe (I think it was him) made, that for all the fans know, the Nicassar could be psychic polar bears or something. Basically, it meant "you don't know what they look like, nor are you going to soon". Some people took it too seriously.

The Blood Angels Codex has the "honor of warriors" stuff. The Necron Codex has the Silent King realising his army was too weak to destroy the Blood Angels, and bitterly slipping away instead of risking defeat. One of the reasons I really like that codex.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: JoelMcKickass on July 08, 2012, 06:10:05 PM
Well, there's a rumour that Fenrisian Wolves are actually ab-humans. Hence why the Space Wolves can't have a successor chapter, due to the failure of the Canis Helix to combine with regular human DNA. The Fenrisian's themselves are slightly modified.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Mordenkenain on July 09, 2012, 12:13:08 PM
Only rumours, I thought everyone just sort of knew it as true by this point, how many times has the phrase "there are no wolves on fenris" been quoted by characters who would know this junk. Magnus the fricking Red stated it, and he KNOWS stuff...
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Heroka Vendile on July 09, 2012, 12:57:31 PM
indeed going on the scale of what we know; Wulfen are those that didn't quite make it as marines, Fenrisian wolves are those who definitely didn't make it, and Thunderwolves... well god only knows.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Keravin on July 09, 2012, 01:43:31 PM
My 13th Company will be over in the corner pretending none of this is happening.  At least we've been retconned so we don't have to be affected by this nonsense.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Koval on July 09, 2012, 06:21:17 PM
Only rumours, I thought everyone just sort of knew it as true by this point, how many times has the phrase "there are no wolves on fenris" been quoted by characters who would know this junk. Magnus the fricking Red stated it, and he KNOWS stuff...
He's Tzeentchian, therefore deceitful. Take with a pinch of salt.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Glorioski on July 09, 2012, 10:57:28 PM
I think the Canis Helix was an answer to the question of why space wolves gene seed inhibited wolf like mutation when the story of Leman Russ appeared to say he gained his wolf like tendencies because he was raised by wolves on Fenris, not because of a mutation in his own gene seed. Therefore why would the rest of his legion show the same mutations? So GW came up with the canis helix as an implant for aspirant Space Wolves.
Title: Re: just brought new 40k rulebook will update you asap
Post by: Mordenkenain on July 11, 2012, 10:38:54 AM
Quote
   
Quote
Only rumours, I thought everyone just sort of knew it as true by this point, how many times has the phrase "there are no wolves on fenris" been quoted by characters who would know this junk. Magnus the fricking Red stated it, and he KNOWS stuff...

He's Tzeentchian, therefore deceitful. Take with a pinch of salt.

indeed, but he stated it before he went all sarum- *ahem* Magnus of many colours, so I'm more inclined to believe him