One last question - Storm troopers

[traveller]

Money in the bank, models in the mail and I have a final question while I wait for the delivery man. How are storm troopers recruited? I work to the assumption they sign up from other IG units like I assume (guesstimate) special forces work IRL.

I ask only because I am, amongst others, getting the severina/sevora sisters and I only actually need one for my warband. I have a few ideas of things to do with them but at the moment, purely from a background point of view, a spec ops woman appeals, just because I figure she would have to 'ard as coffin nails to make it.

I am also looking for a big sculpting project to get me back into things. I haven't touched a model in years and what better way to get back into it than an over ambitious project which will keep me occupied for the foreseeable future.

Thanks

[Inquisitor Octavian Lars]

Most storm troopers are sons of high ranking guard officers taken into the schola progenium. My Iquisitor, Octavian Lars was the son of a catachan colonel and learned to shoot there (i.e. a schola progenium centre on the planet Volag Nok). P.S you may use Volag Nok if you wish for the story (just don't make your character meet mine).

[Dolnikan]

Storm Troopers are recruited from the Schola Progenium. Here the orphaned children of imperial officials such as officers go to be raised and when they are a little older, around twelve they will be selected for a more specific function such as storm trooper training.

[DapperAnarchist]

While Stormtroopers proper (members the Munitorium managed specialist Stormtrooper Regiments) are Schola Progenium, Veteran Regiments or Veteran Squads come from within existing regiments and can often equal or exceed Stormtroopers in ability - the Kasrkin are strictly a Veteran formation, not Stormtroopers, while many regiments keep "Dirty Dozen" type squads of Veterans for specialist work, such as sniping, demolition, or leading assaults. The Stormtroopers are infantry combat style not really practiced by modern armies, as its very dangerous - armoured foot troops striking at enemy emplacements. Modern special forces, such as the recently successful Team Six, are more stealth-oriented than traditional Stormtroopers, and so might be closer to the best of the Veteran squads - compare Stormtroopers to the Ghost Scout squads of the Tanith.

[N01H3r3]

While Stormtroopers proper (members the Munitorium managed specialist Stormtrooper Regiments) are Schola Progenium,

Strictly speaking, there is only a single Storm Trooper Regiment, though it is extremely large.

As an aside, it's likely that the Storm Trooper Regiment is exclusively male, given that the best of the female Progena are sent to the Adepta Sororitas.

[DapperAnarchist]

Ah! I wasn't sure about that - I considered the possibility that each Schola has its own regiment, or that they are attached to munitorum command posts in sector capitals, or something. I will trust you on this though.

[MarcoSkoll]

While the Sororitas does mean it will be rare that a Stormtrooper is female, I wouldn't say it never happens. I personally imagine only the most fervent females are recruited for the Sororitas, the others assigned as befits their academic successes.

And actually, given the Sororitas have been brought up... the Decree Passive only affects armed troops, yes?
So why does the Sororitas have non-militant orders? Surely the roles of the Dialogus, Famulous and Hospitaller need not be all-female.

[N01H3r3]

While the Sororitas does mean it will be rare that a Stormtrooper is female, I wouldn't say it never happens. I personally imagine only the most fervent females are recruited for the Sororitas, the others assigned as befits their academic successes.

And actually, given the Sororitas have been brought up... the Decree Passive only affects armed troops, yes?
So why does the Sororitas have non-militant orders? Surely the roles of the Dialogus, Famulous and Hospitaller need not be all-female.

No, they don't, but it's a matter of perspective.

As I see it, the Adepta Sororitas are an all-female organisation because of choice and tradition, an extension of the ancient doctrines of the Daughters of the Emperor of San Leor. With or without the Decree Passive, they're an all-female organisation, because that's what their structures and traditions demand. The fact that the loophole in the Decree Passive permits women-under-arms means that they can maintain the Orders Militant, but the Decree Passive isn't why the Orders Non-Militant exist.

In short, while the Decree Passive does not prevent men from performing roles equivalent to the duties of the Orders Non-Militant, the Adepta Sororitas simply doesn't accept male initiates.

[MarcoSkoll]

Ah. Very, very badly phrased on my part. I had an idea in my head and most of it didn't make it into the post. I'm afraid that's a bad habit of mine, making logical leaps that I forget to explain. I'll try again...

~~~~~

On a few occasions, female Progena in some of the other organisations have been assumed to be scarce, because they tend to go to the Sororitas.
But this doesn't seem right, given that the roles the non-militant Orders fulfil could as easily be recruited for from the male progena.

There's either the assumption that the Ecclesiarchy are favouring female recruits (but not that meaning of favour...) even when male recruits might be better for the role, or that they're also recruiting a statistically significant percentage of the male recruits. (Which wouldn't leave a whole lot for other Imperial organisations.)

Also, I think it's a reasonably fair assumption that females are at least in fair proportions to males amongst Progena, so the idea that such a significant percentage of female recruits was being recruited as to make them scarce elsewhere would make the Sororitas several times larger than any other Imperial organisations.

As such, I think it's fair to say that the impact the Ecclesiarchy's "first choice" has on the overall gender balance is not going to be as total as has often been said, and that female Progena will be found in reasonable numbers in other Imperial organisations. Perhaps not the same numbers, but they will be there.

[N01H3r3]

But this doesn't seem right, given that the roles the non-militant Orders fulfil could as easily be recruited for from the male progena.

To an extent, sure (though I don't think anyone attempts eugenics on the same scale as the Order Famulous, who in Blood of Martyrs for Dark Heresy, have gained a distinctly Bene Gesserit feel), but they'd logically perform those roles in distinct organisations (most likely distinct Departments, Divisions and Offices within the Administratum, as that's a good catch-all location to put anything that doesn't easily fit elsewhere)

There's either the assumption that the Ecclesiarchy are favouring female recruits (but not that meaning of favour...) even when male recruits might be better for the role, or that they're also recruiting a statistically significant percentage of the male recruits. (Which wouldn't leave a whole lot for other Imperial organisations.)

They're probably recruiting both - afterall, there are plenty of significant positions in the Ecclesiarchy (as opposed to the allied Adepta Sororitas) that can be filled by Progena of either gender.

Also, I think it's a reasonably fair assumption that females are at least in fair proportions to males amongst Progena, so the idea that such a significant percentage of female recruits was being recruited as to make them scarce elsewhere would make the Sororitas several times larger than any other Imperial organisations.

Not really - few organisations recruit purely from the Schola Progenium. Really, the Adepta Sororitas and the Storm Trooper Regiment are the only two I can think of that only take Progena (and the Adepta Sororitas is much, much larger than the Storm Trooper Regiment).

Consider the Administratum - the single largest organisation within the Adeptus Terra. The overwhelming majority of its personnel are hereditary indentured workers, supplemented by non-Adepts with useful minor skills (known collectively as Menials). While I imagine that the Administratum does take on a number of Progena, I can't imagine that any of them enter the organisation as anything less than an Ordinate or Prefect Tertius, in a twisted form of nepotism (those the Imperium has raised are given positions of significance within it), but Progena would not comprise anything more than a small proportion of even those mid-level positions within the Administratum.

Similar could be said of the Imperial Navy - officers are drawn both from the Progena and from noble/socially powerful families across the Imperium (the latter typically have a long history of Naval service anyway).

As far as I can tell, the Adepta Sororitas is the single largest organisation that recruits purely from the Schola Progenium - all larger organisations recruit from other sources as well, while all other Progena-only organisations are significantly smaller.

As such, I think it's fair to say that the impact the Ecclesiarchy's "first choice" has on the overall gender balance is not going to be as total as has often been said, and that female Progena will be found in reasonable numbers in other Imperial organisations. Perhaps not the same numbers, but they will be there.

Not total, but I didn't imply that - I was only discussing the divide between those destined for the Adepta Sororitas' Orders Militant and the Storm Trooper Regiment. Given that both groups require essentially the same high standards of martial skill, physical ability, discipline, and both are of comparable size (strictly speaking, the Orders Militant are significantly larger than the Storm Trooper Regiment - 2nd edition background has the Orders Militant at only 30,000 Sisters, while the Storm Trooper Regiment consists of only 10,000 soldiers... I'm personally not keen on those numbers, as I regard them to be ridiculously small given the scale of the Imperium, and tend to assume values 3-4 orders of magnitude higher)

The Adepta Sororitas, large as it is, gets first pick of female Progena... given that they and the Storm Trooper Regiment are competing for recruits of the same standard, it stands to reason that female Storm Troopers would be essentially unheard-of. This doesn't affect other organisations, which don't typically recruit only from Progena and which may not be competing so directly with the Adepta Sororitas for recruits anyway.

[MarcoSkoll]

given that they and the Storm Trooper Regiment are competing for recruits of the same standard

I don't see that they are competing for recruits of the same standard. The Militant Sororitas are not simply any girl who can use a gun, they're also of exceptional faith.

No Progena will have weak faith, but I find it doubtful that every/almost every militarily competent female Progena is also seen as utterly devoted enough in her belief as to serve as a champion for it.

[Dolnikan]

If I recall correctly there are more groups which recruit only form the progena, such as the commissars and the Adeptus Arbites.

[N01H3r3]

If I recall correctly there are more groups which recruit only form the progena, such as the commissars and the Adeptus Arbites.

I don't think I've ever seen anything to suggest that the Arbites recruit only Progena; Commissars, on the other tend, tend often to be recruited from the Storm Trooper Regiment rather than directly from the Schola Progenium.

[Ulgavitch]

I don't think I've ever seen anything to suggest that the Arbites recruit only Progena; Commissars, on the other tend, tend often to be recruited from the Storm Trooper Regiment rather than directly from the Schola Progenium.

That's not how I've always understood it. Commissars are mostly Schola graduates - why would you choose a promotion to a role where you shoot your comrades?

That way, they have no problems with mixed loyalties or a lack of indoctrination. Schola students come ready made with all of these already!

I think the Arbites do recruit from Schola's, again making sure that they are separated from those they are ruling. There is a SG article in the archive about schola Students, which makes reference to the fact if they are going into the Arbites they spend two years studying Imperial Law.


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