New Char - The negotiator

[Sneak]

Mkay so Ive decided on my new warbands leader, the most important part I figure since it will define the entire group.

I cant imagine a model appearing till after xmas, Im gonna be busy and I need to root around my grans attic to find all my old inq stuff (Im gonna need a lot of my bits box ) and goddamn uni loan wont come through till then... BUT... that doesnt mean I cant ask for some feedback re. the character.

I was thinking of a persuasive telepath character... Im not thinking of giving him puppet master just yet though :p I was thinking more the wormtongue character from lord of the rings, but less greasy... someone who has worked his way to a position of power, probably political or judicial power (what better way to feel important that being in charge of people) using his powers.

Powers wise he will probably have Enforce Will & Distraction/Mesmerism as these are the sort of powers I would imagine would help further a political career. He should have discovered his powers, or at least recognised his uncanny ability to get his own way, at an early age, which would make him an arrogant character, I cant see him wearing much armour, or for that matter doing too much fighting.

Id imagine he would in his younger years have used his powers for more immediate gains (women, money, women) before it occured to him to use his powers for something more long term so he should be a fairly well off successful type of guy in most senses of the word.

Now to the important questions:
Why has he got off his rich powerful backside to trawl the 40k mulitiverse looking for trouble?
Im thinking a character like this is on a quest for something quite specific... probably heard some whispers about an object of great power gifting people ultimate power over others... that sort of thing... He would definately be after something specific to further his career/lifespan etc

Who would follow him?
I cant decide. He could very easily bring himself a bodyguard from the palace/local guard etc. (which could save me a few quid since I have an unfinished unpainted model of a respectable looking guardsman somewhere) but I could also imagine him having some weak willed but definitely strong armed companion who serves and looks up to him "of his own free will". This I could also use an old work in progress for, or I have some ideas for another model.

The third and most interesting (to me) option is to have the beautiful but deadly (insert femme fatale name here) by his side... perhaps one of his youthful conquests who revealed herself to have a certain skill... or perhaps like the lady sent to assassinate Castro, who fell in love with him and refused to go through with her task... she should certainly be deadly.

Model wise, I was thinking of a bounty hunter conversion (I love his jacket) with a more respectable head and less guns. Femme fatale is clearly a severina/sevora convert, again a nice head and maybe some clothes and if I can find the time/greenstuff/skill make her a nice billowy dress just like all femme fatales need.

I was also thinking I may make him a daemon huntress conversion for his more visible bodyguard and have him surrounded by women (as he ought to be). Get rid of the =][= signs and give her a nicely oversized sword.

I am gonna think about my other character possibilities through my next lecture so expect more, but any feedback/advice/back story help would be appreciated. Im still trying to work out why he wasnt carted away with the rest of the psykers and Im not naive enough to think he could, at a tender young age, persuade them to just leave him alone

Edit: Asked my friend what he thought and he just txt me to remind me that men, like wolves, hunt in packs... he would no doubt have some upper class fop ally who would tag along for the promise of adventure...

[Myriad]

A good base here.  The thing that needs explaining is how an unsanctioned psyker has achieved such a position without attracting attention.  This could explain what's got him off his backside, should he happen to have acquired an inquisitorial 'patron'.

[Holiad]

The upper class fop ally might also account for his evading the blackships-witnessing a young child manifest potentially useful psychic powers, it's quite possible a noble might hide him hoping to use his abilities for their own ends rather than turn him over to the proper authorities. The imperial nobility is, after all, corrupt. After that, and properly cautioned against being caught, it wouldn't be too hard for him to escape capture by keeping a low profile, and limiting himself to powers which aren't outwardly obvious.  Low-level telepathy powers fit pretty well for such a character, but enforce will seems a little obvious an effect to go unnoticed among politicians-perhaps his growing political ambition was his undoing, requiring greater and more obvious use of his powers until trying to control the wrong person required a hasty departure. 
Exit stage left, pursued by witch hunter?

[Sneak]

I like that idea Holiad. Keep em coming... things like this I dont have the knowledge or memory of 40k to do. I havent played any GW game in a good 5 years.

I also just remembered my biggest weakness. I cant help myself. I was trawling through models to work out what to buy, If I had unlimited money and time Im fairly sure I know what models I would make to represent this guys small army rather than his small warband :S

I like the idea of some low ranking noble taking him under his wing in order to help himself become a high ranking noble. It would also mean that his ally would be out more to protect his families interests, making sure that my character became more powerful without ever becoming too powerful or independent.

I was thinking of enforce will more in the sense of "are you sure you are right, I put across such a compelling argument" than "shine my shoes shoe shine" but I see what you are saying. The rulebook unfortunately doesnt give me a sort of inbetween power :p

Stats and a proper character list will be forthcoming... I should get that done tonight once I work out exactly who Im going to add and in what order. In the meantime I appreciate any further suggestions.

[Inquisitor Cade]

Have you seen the character of Frum in Uilleam's  thread? He too is a rogue telepath, and has the same sort of powers; enforce will and distraction. As a result, however he is paranoid of the inquisition and spends most of his time outside the imperium to avoid them. In fact he has failed and is being secretly protected by a group of radically inclined Inquisitors. If this character is to be a rogue psyker operating, or who used to operate, as a high profile, high importance politician then might I suggest he be a very weak telepath, potentially not even aware that his ability to persuade is a result of psychic power at all, or at least not powerful enough that his rise to power would be suspicious to any witch hunters.

I would suggest a power along these lines in place of the very difficult enforce will:

Suggestion
Cast on a targets he is aware of and can communicate with easily. The character makes a psychic test at difficulty 0 +5 per target beyond the first. If he passes then the targets become suggestible and the amount he passes by becomes a negative modifier to the targets' Wp for 3 (or so) turns the purposes of persuading them. A suggestible character can then be persuaded of the something if the caster persuader can win an opposed Wp test. Persuading takes actions as talking. GMs should apply modifiers to tests if the target is particularly resistant to the issue (e.g. trying to persuade a preacher that the emperor isn't a god would be much more difficult).

He could use this to win political followers, getting great prices on anything he buys or sells and for convincing women that he is the man they've been waiting for, as would seem to be his way. He couldn't however get the full power of mind control.

I think the 'surrounded by women' idea suits him but assuming the femme' fatale is a knifey poisony kind of girl wouldn't it be a bit more diverse and tactically sound to give the other one a powerful gun rather than an oversized sword?

[Sneak]

I cant believe I havent thought of a name for this guy yet... so far hes referred to throughout my notes/plans like a cheap aussie lager... XXXX

good point about the guns... at least one guy with a gun would maybe be a good idea, though if you ask me it takes the honour out of fighting :p I guess the guy on the other side with a chaingun isnt going to see it like that though is he.

I like that power. That pretty much suits what I had thought of... definitely a "put the gun down (please)" power. Im working up a very basic back story and some stats for him and his friendlies at the moment, largely based on the helpful suggestions ive got so far. I will probably post them up in a new thread by Monday. Its my friends birthday tomorrow so I doubt I will be able to do anything other than drink, be loud and make mess everywhere until then.

One question I have, what sort of Wp/Nv would this guy have... I mean he hasnt had any official training in the ways of the psyker so I dont think hes going to be one of these Wp = 100 superbrains but even without the power he will have led a life enforcing control over his underlings and avoiding becoming an underling for the guy on the next rung of the ladder.

Similarly with Nv. I expect he would be an exceedingly arrogant person... not so much arrogant in the "they will never hit an elephant at this dist..." way but definitely confident in his ability to talk someone out of hurting him. I was thinking of something along the lines of;

Are you sure you want to do this?
edit: realised I could just use the first half of fearsome ability for this...

And I was thinking of a willpower around 65-70, nerve around 50-60

[Aidan]

I like this, non-inquisitor led bands are always interesting. The character ideas are good, and telepaths are neat in that they have difficulty being world-shatteringly powerful. I'd even be okay with this guy having enforce will, except that - as Cade points out - it is frightfully difficult to cast (with a regular difficulty of at least 25, often 30+), and with that success rate our daring telepath would have been sniffed out by the witch hunters long ago.

Cade's suggest power is a good one, though you might also want to know some of the other powers which have appeared in this kind of category - I make use of all of them, being a fond user of Telepaths myself (I have 4 among my 50+ characters).

One is 'Suggest', from the article 'packing heat':

Suggest Difficulty: 15
The psyker reaches out with his mind as he states something
simply like: 'These aren't the servitors you're looking for.' As he
states this obvious lie his mind detaches his victims suspicion and
leaves them apparently listening to an undeniable fact. If the
psyker passes this test then everyone who is relevant and within
earshot must pass a willpower test modified by the amount the
psyker past his test by.

There is also 'Mind Trick' from the Recongregator Sourcebook:

Mind Trick (Difficulty: 1/5 Target's Willpower; Telepathy)
The psyker coats his words with an impression of
candour and helpfulness, leading the target to accept as
fact whatever half-truths and bald-faced lies he is told.
This power is always used as a combined action with
speaking, though no additional penalty is inflicted for this.
As long as the target can hear the psyker speaking, they
must pass a Sagacity test with a negative modifier equal
to the amount that the psychic test was passed by.
Failure results in the target implicitly believing any
reasonable lie he is presented with (GM's discretion as to
what constitutes "reasonable"). Failure by more than
50% means that the target will believe absolutely
anything - the possibilities from the Hallucinations table
make for a good starting point.

Either of those could be used for the 'you don't want to hurt me' or 'you should drop that gun' suggestions, and are much more reliable than enforce will.

And on a different scale, 'Mass Suggestion', from the same sourcebook:

Mass Suggestion (Difficulty: 5 per Target; Telepathy)
The psyker plays on the emotions of those around him,
implanting powerful subconscious impulses and ideas in
the minds of the masses. This is a ranged power; the
psyker chooses the range, which this is the radius
affected; any characters within it that are not specifically
excluded are considered targets. A one-word suggestion
is hammered into the minds of all targets ("fight", "stop",
"jump", etc.); they must each pass a Willpower test or do
as commanded (to follow the examples above, they might
attack the nearest character, break their aim, stand up
from behind cover and hop, etc).

- - - - -

Willpower 70ish should be fine - its good to stray away from too high willpowers with psykers (though I admit I have a few normal humans with willpowers in the mid-80s!). The lowest WP I have on a psyker char is 64 (an untrained biomancer), and he does an ok job, but is very unreliable. Last scenario we tried and failed once to have him pop an enemy, before resolving to have him just beat the guy up and throw him off the platform he was standing on...

Nerve 50-60 is good for what I call a 'sensible' character - someone with a powerful survival instinct so that they are neither a hopeless coward (not very good for survival in the long run!) nor a risk-taker.

- - - - -

The "femme fatale" sounds like a good character - though I know from experience that utilising a sneaky poisoner-type effectively is quite difficult. It hasn't been tried to often, though - highly trained assassins tend to be favoured, which I find a pity. A word of caution about using the severina/sevora models: they are inhumanly proportioned, very tall and thin. They can make good 'armatures' to sculpt over though, and if you don't mind your lady towering over the others (although to me recollection the bounty hunter is tall too), she is an easy model to convert. I'd say a dress is a must-have though, over that ghastly BDSM outfit. Another possibility I have seen (one I suggested for a friend, and worked very well) is severina/sevora's torso attached to Helena Jericho's lower body, with the assassins arms re-positioned, of course. Helena also has a face not obscured by a mask and bionic bits (unsuited for a femme fatale!) of course, that would involve getting two models, and if your stretched for money (I know what its like working with a uni loan...) that should be taken into consideration.

BTW, the 'lady who was sent to poison El Commandante but fell in love', was actually a former lover of Fidel payed to kill him, who then realised she didn't have it in her to be quite so evil. Given that he holds the world record for over 600 failed attempts on his life, it's not surprising that an amateur assassin like her failed. One can only hope Fidel's more democratic proteges have the same survivability...

- - - - -

Ah yes, and I second the idea that an upper-class fop would make a suitable patron for this rogue, explaining his ability to remain protected from the puritanical fanatics who police Imperial society. It's also a nice idea to have someone for a main character to have to answer to, or at least respect the interests of - another reason to approve of non-Inquisitor characters.

- - - - -

Hope that some of that was at least somewhat helpful.

-Aidan.

[Sneak]

I worked up a pair of powers based on cades suggestion:

Suggestion: Cast on a targets he is aware of and can communicate with easily. The character makes a psychic test at difficulty 0 +5 per target beyond the first. If he passes then the targets become suggestible and the amount he passes by becomes a negative modifier to the targets' Wp for D3 turns for the purposes of persuading them. Any suggestible character will believe almost anything the caster suggests to him but can attempt to see sense by taking a Wp test modified as above.
Persuading must be done verbally, it takes actions accordingly & can be heard by other nearby characters. GMs should apply modifiers to tests if the target is particularly resistant to the issue (e.g. trying to persuade a preacher that the emperor isn't a god would be much more difficult).

Are you sure about this?: Seeing the present danger of a charging foe Vincent stares directly at them, and calmly but confidently asks simply "are you sure about this?" - Any enemy charging Vincent will treat him as fearsome, testing against their Wp rather than Nv. A character who has previously been rendered suggestible from the above power will use his modified 'suggestible' Wp

Another possibility I have seen (one I suggested for a friend, and worked very well) is severina/sevora's torso attached to Helena Jericho's lower body, with the assassins arms re-positioned

Do you have pics of this Helena Jericho? Ive been thinking about maybe a new torso on Jena Orechiel instead, since she actually has a face, but she seems painfully thin, the majority of the model being her cloak.

I hadnt envisaged her being a death cultist trained professional but as she represents a good amount of my warbands hitting power I envisaged her being pretty good at what she does. Im still working on fluffing her out so I cant really tell you why just yet.

Oh and as for finances, yes Im a starving student, thats why everything is going to happen after xmas.

Also do you know if they still make the navy bodyguard model. He would be a perfect base for the fop... bit beefy and needs an arm and a leg transplant but would be a good start & I like his clothes.

Of all my characters (not quite 50+... jealous) I have one very powerful old inquisitor who tends to have some association with just about all my warbands, usually they are unknowingly working for him or one of his agents, though after this long the only reason he hasnt died of old age/been eaten by a genestealer/sacrificed to the blood god is because I havent played for so long. I doubt he will see action again.

[Kaled]

Do you have pics of this Helena Jericho? Ive been thinking about maybe a new torso on Jena Orechiel

Originally the Jena model was supposed to be Helena Jerico, but for some legal reason that I forget they pulled the 54mm Kal model and renamed Helena leaving a few hints here and there that they're the same person (such as their names being anagrams).

[Aidan]

Do you have pics of this Helena Jericho? Ive been thinking about maybe a new torso on Jena Orechiel

Originally the Jena model was supposed to be Helena Jerico, but for some legal reason that I forget they pulled the 54mm Kal model and renamed Helena leaving a few hints here and there that they're the same person (such as their names being anagrams).

Heh heh... yeah, sorry about that one. I've always just called the model 'Helena Jerico', it slips off the toung much better. People have asked me about it before though, so you'd think I'd learn... Yeah, a new torso on her legs is good - the problem with her torso is that its in one chunk with her arms, cape, and her dress is cut lower than John Howard's approval rating. 

The model is thin, but no more so than the death cultists, and it shows less because of her dress. I'd have to get permission from my friend before I put up a picture of his model, though, so I can't show you what he did with it.

Death cultists aren't necessarily trained professionals... but their image which is really silly. You can make your poisoner however good you like - it's between you and your GM - and there's no reason an 'amateur' assassin couldn't be good at what she does. Just come up with something - as long as she's not too powerful people here wouldn't mind.

They don't make the bodyguard anymore, sadly. I only started collecting last year, so I never got a chance at any of the discontinued models either. Occasionally one will appear on ebay or something, but that's for more internet-bound people than me to find.

Oh and as for finances, yes Im a starving student, thats why everything is going to happen after xmas.

Well, it's not too long to wait...

Believe it or not, I'm also a student working on a loan. I just have a wealthy benefactor (my grandmother, or rather my grandfather's massive pension for being a top-level bureaucrat) who has contributed a lot to my ability to accumulate models. Also, buying outside the GW range helps. That I've completed 54 models (or 59, depending what you count) in under two years is more a testament to an obsessive approach to the hobby. It could be useful, given that I know only two other people in the city who play inquisitor.

- - - - -

Are you sure about this?: Seeing the present danger of a charging foe Vincent stares directly at them, and calmly but confidently asks simply "are you sure about this?" - Any enemy charging Vincent will treat him as fearsome, testing against their Wp rather than Nv. A character who has previously been rendered suggestible from the above power will use his modified 'suggestible' Wp

I am, no joke intended, not really sure about this. While I understand the idea, it would seem a little odd - most of my characters wouldn't bother listening to what some dude is saying when they're preparing to lop his head off - unless there is a powerful psychic trick behind it, in which case you could just give him a power to make himself 'fearsome' (like terrify, just weaker) and leave it at that. But it's up to you. If you do use it, having the 'suggestible' modifier makes good sense.

I have one very powerful old inquisitor who tends to have some association with just about all my warbands, usually they are unknowingly working for him or one of his agents, though after this long the only reason he hasnt died of old age/been eaten by a genestealer/sacrificed to the blood god is because I havent played for so long. I doubt he will see action again.

Well, If you ever GM you can always make him turn up again at the point when your players least expect it...

- - - - -

-Aidan.

[Sneak]

I am, no joke intended, not really sure about this. While I understand the idea, it would seem a little odd - most of my characters wouldn't bother listening to what some dude is saying when they're preparing to lop his head off - unless there is a powerful psychic trick behind it

There is a psychic trick behind it... its essentially a last desperate attempt at his first power before he runs like a girl. So far he has some BS and a pistol but is gonna make a baby girl look like bruce lee in hand to hand combat...

in which case you could just give him a power to make himself 'fearsome' (like terrify, just weaker) and leave it at that. But it's up to you. If you do use it, having the 'suggestible' modifier makes good sense

it is a power to make him fearsome :p just testing a more appropriate stat.

To be fair, defensive as I am, and much as I know exactly I mean by the power, I see your point...

this would be the situation I envisage:
seeing the well dressed and obviously physically inferior being ahead of him, Grakkus hefted his great axe from his backstrap and smiled the wry smile that had preceded so many notches on its hilt. He started towards the figure, slowly at first but building the momentum he knew would crush his foe into the ground.

Grakkus, slower than most took a moment to register that the figure was still stood stock still, but even at sprint pace had time to register that this was not the usual response. Then the figure spoke;
"are you sure you want to do this?"
it said in a soft tone, and for the first time in over forty years, a long time for a brute warrior, Grakkus wasnt sure. No one should stand and wait like that unless impossibly confident in his abilities, and maybe if he was that confident in his ability to beat such a formidable opponent as Grakkus the Cleaver... well that really is confidence.

Grakkus slowed to better analyse the situation, as best he could at least, stopped, looked at his axe then back at the figure... who promptly turned and ran as far and as fast as he could

Its not so much an ability to allow him to gain the charging advantage but more how a little posh boy has survived in the seedy side of the 41st millennium.

Stats and fluff are almost done for all the characters, but still having no models means I have no idea about equipment beyond "i want him to have a pistol, him to have a sword". 

[Holiad]

Just as a thought, given his dimunutive appearance-as an alternative to directly challenging an immediate threat, and drawing attention to himself in the process, might it not be easier, and more in character, for him to persuade them that he was relatively insignificant, and therefore that other objectives should take precedence over hurting him? Along those lines, how about a persistent power that prevents an affected character from taking aggressive action against him? A very useful survival tool in several situations, and potentially amusing if his concentration were to fail at the wrong moment...

[Sneak]

I like the sound of that... so more along the lines of "why would I waste my time smashing that puny thing... he looks so harmless, he would only slow down my quest to find a worthy adversary... ah what the hell" *splat*

I suppose he would have the common sense to just use his first power on the raging mad axe man and suggest they leave him alone :p

Persistent powers are the bane of my life. Ive hardly ever played with a proper GM, just sort of worked things out as we went along, and I absolutely fail at remembering things like that.

Thinking about it, it would definitely just be easier for him to just use his suggest power with the one action spoken sentence: "he went thatta way" than have two rules which will essentially serve the same purpose.

p.s. Is it more sensible to post fluff & stats in this or a separate topic? Id imagine its gonna be a nice long post (or several if I get the rest of the guys stuff there too)