The Conclave

This is my first inquisitor character and I am wondering if people think he is OTT or fine as he is bearing in mind he is a grizzled inquisitor aged around 123

Ezekeel first gained the attention of the inquisition at a young age as he led a loyalist uprising against a renegade PDF that had claimed control of the planet Craxis V, his fiery vigour and unshakable faith in the emperor guided the loyalists through the dark times and bitter fighting that ensued while they awaited the relief force that was promised to be coming. Instead of taking the year that was given, the relief force turned up 10 years into the conflict due to 'logistical errors' causing Ezekeel to become the not only the militaristic leader of uprising but also the spiritual guide for the remaining loyalists.

After the PDF had been crushed by the relief force he was quickly hunted down and offered a place in the personal retinue of Lord Inquisitor Irrus of the Ordo Hereticus to which he accepted almost instantly. He quickly proved his worth in Irrus' retinue with his unshakable faith that the Emperor has a master plan and that when his time of death comes only then will he die, and even then he does not intend to go quietly. This ideology has caused him to fight past incredible pain as he strode through shootouts to crush his foes with his great hammer, on many accounts he had shrugged off grievous injuries that would have sent lesser men into pain induced comas.

While in service of Irrus one of the greatest feats of his true grit was as Irrus had tracked down a smuggler who traded both alien and chaotic items, as the smuggler was running and the rest of the retinue was pinned from unseen marksmen, Ezekeel stormed across the open warehouse floor taking a serious sniper round through his left leg and into the small room in which the smuggler had taken cover. Ezekeel engaged the smuggler in one on one combat in which the smuggler wielded a strange alien whip that caused tremendous pain upon contact (it was later identified to be a agoniser created in the black forges of the dark eldar). Ezekeel finally brought the duel to an end by catching the whip with his left arm and dragged the heretic over to him before caving his head in with his trusty hammer. It was upon this event he was granted access to his now greatly feared Power Hammer that was picked from the stolen goods retaken from the smuggler. He eventually gained his status of inquisitor through many more years of gruelling service to Irrus, upon his title he was given a conversion field as a symbol of his status.

He has firmly believed that the heretic only truly perishes if you bleed the life from them with your own hands and so has dedicated his life to the art of melee combat as well as building his strength through intense weight training, this has caused him to have the build of a weight lifter that many mistake for fat. Perhaps his greatest example of his sheer determination not to die was upon the moon of Ghorrus III on which he tracked down his old mentor Irrus who had turned from the Emperor's light, they skirmished for days on end before finally meeting face to face on the great ash wastes that scarred the moon's surface.

Both warbands were truly destroyed in the clash in which mentor fought pupil at the centre, the engagement ended when Irrus cleaved Ezekeel's right arm from his body at the shoulder. As he lay twisted Irrus savoured the moment of his 'victory' but as he turned his back and let out a roar of victory Ezekeel rose behind him with his severed arm clutched as a weapon and broke Irrus' back with a single swing of his arm before he preceded to pulp Irrus' head with a torrent of left hooks. Shortly after his victory Ezekeel was granted a robotic arm to enhance his already tremendous strength, from that day on Ezekeel no longer fears death and storms across the battlefield as any other man would dive to cover or be frozen in fear.

It is whispered that he is no longer sane or cares for his life and the fire in his eyes in the crucible of combat proves to many. So now Ezekeel roams the galaxy with his hardened retinue crushing his foes with his dreaded hammer and his hardened resolve.     

                                  WS BS   S   T    I    Wp   Sg  Nv  Ld
Inquisitor Ezekeel      86  41  90 85  50   65   47  85  85
Abilities: Leader, True Grit, Force of Will and Nerves of Steel
Equipment: Power Hammer, Robes everywhere except the head, Advanced Right Bionic Arm and Conversion Field

Leader represents the fact he is an inquisitor and that his men would follow him into the warp itself
True Grit represents his absolute faith and his ability to ignore pain because of it
Force of Will and Nerves of Steel represent his ideology and his complete lack of fear, either of death or the warp

Be gentle...  :P

You're making the same mistakes I did with this guy's statline when I started genning characters again after Emperor knows how long an absence -- the WS, S (even accounting for his bionic arm), T, Nv and Ld are crazy high whereas the BS and Sg (and arguably his Wp -- he's an Inquisitor) are way too low. It might be worth having a read of this article over on Carthax (http://carthax.wikispaces.com/Creating+Characters) and this thread where the idea of a "Conclave Standard" character gets hammered out (http://www.the-conclave.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=162.0). Incidentally, those links explain why having Force of Will, Nerves of Steel and True Grit all on the same character is only really appropriate if he's an Arco-Flagellant :P

He really needs a gun of some sort, ideology or not, otherwise he's going to come across as horribly underprepared. The power hammer is kinda tolerable but your only real justification for it is "he found it among stolen goods" -- honestly, something like "Irrus decided he needed an upgrade and requisitioned one for him" works better.

I'd have a look at those two threads I linked, have a look at other people's characters, and play about with Ezekeel's profile for a bit so that you still have something strong, but more in-line with the local norm.


You could do with spacing your background out a bit, so that it isn't a huge wall that turns people off -- I'll have a go for you.

Quote from: Inquisitor Ezekeel on August 26, 2012, 12:58:54 AM
Ezekeel first gained the attention of the inquisition at a young age as he led a loyalist uprising against a renegade PDF that had claimed control of the planet Craxis V, his fiery vigour and unshakable faith in the emperor guided the loyalists through the dark times and bitter fighting that ensued while they awaited the relief force that was promised to be coming. Instead of taking the year that was given, the relief force turned up 10 years into the conflict due to 'logistical errors' causing Ezekeel to become the not only the militaristic leader of uprising but also the spiritual guide for the remaining loyalists.

After the PDF had been crushed by the relief force he was quickly hunted down and offered a place in the personal retinue of Lord Inquisitor Irrus of the Ordo Hereticus to which he accepted almost instantly. He quickly proved his worth in Irrus' retinue with his unshakable faith that the Emperor has a master plan and that when his time of death comes only then will he die, and even then he does not intend to go quietly. This ideology has caused him to fight past incredible pain as he strode through shootouts to crush his foes with his great hammer, on many accounts he had shrugged off grievous injuries that would have sent lesser men into pain induced comas.

While in service of Irrus one of the greatest feats of his true grit was as Irrus had tracked down a smuggler who traded both alien and chaotic items, as the smuggler was running and the rest of the retinue was pinned from unseen marksmen, Ezekeel stormed across the open warehouse floor taking a serious sniper round through his left leg and into the small room in which the smuggler had taken cover. Ezekeel engaged the smuggler in one on one combat in which the smuggler wielded a strange alien whip that caused tremendous pain upon contact (it was later identified to be a agoniser created in the black forges of the dark eldar). Ezekeel finally brought the duel to an end by catching the whip with his left arm and dragged the heretic over to him before caving his head in with his trusty hammer. It was upon this event he was granted access to his now greatly feared Power Hammer that was picked from the stolen goods retaken from the smuggler.

He eventually gained his status of inquisitor through many more years of gruelling service to Irrus, upon his title he was given a conversion field as a symbol of his status. He has firmly believed that the heretic only truly perishes if you bleed the life from them with your own hands and so has dedicated his life to the art of melee combat as well as building his strength through intense weight training, this has caused him to have the build of a weight lifter that many mistake for fat.

Perhaps his greatest example of his sheer determination not to die was upon the moon of Ghorrus III on which he tracked down his old mentor Irrus who had turned from the Emperor's light, they skirmished for days on end before finally meeting face to face on the great ash wastes that scarred the moon's surface. Both warbands were truly destroyed in the clash in which mentor fought pupil at the centre, the engagement ended when Irrus cleaved Ezekeel's right arm from his body at the shoulder. As he lay twisted Irrus savoured the moment of his 'victory' but as he turned his back and let out a roar of victory Ezekeel rose behind him with his severed arm clutched as a weapon and broke Irrus' back with a single swing of his arm before he preceded to pulp Irrus' head with a torrent of left hooks.

Shortly after his victory Ezekeel was granted a robotic arm to enhance his already tremendous strength, from that day on Ezekeel no longer fears death and storms across the battlefield as any other man would dive to cover or be frozen in fear. It is whispered that he is no longer sane or cares for his life and the fire in his eyes in the crucible of combat proves to many. So now Ezekeel roams the galaxy with his hardened retinue crushing his foes with his dreaded hammer and his hardened resolve.     

This is more readable and easier to critique.

I'm not sure whether that basic S stat includes his bionic arm (and if it does, I would suggest it doesn't - I would never count an arm's strength for such things as jumping distances or knockback values).

If it doesn't, then I'd say he's WAY too strong.  Definitely excessively tough, in any case.

Given that a stat of 100 represents the absolute limits of normal human ability, to the point that it would only be achievable by the perfectly focused dedication (to the exclusion of almost all else) by a very few "perfect" humans, the fact he totes five stats above 80 is a bit of a stretch.

While you do have freedom to pick stats, there's not much point to the game if characters are practically autopassing their rolls - it's much more fun to have the element of chance.

With that in mind, I'd argue for lowering his WS, S* and T. Even at 10 points off each, he'd still be very nasty in combat. The Ld couldn't hurt to come down a mite too.   
(*Assuming bionics aren't counted. If they are, then that's more reasonable, but I repeat my earlier recommendation that it's not ideal to count bionics in basic stats)

The Nv - I'd say that's acceptable if he really is as fanatical and borderline suicidal as you say, but I'd lose the Nerves of Steel and Force of Will. I only normally use those skills for characters who are incapable of feeling fear rather than merely fearless in its standard sense. (And again, refer to my "Auto passing rolls is boring" statement above.)
However, his Initiative, Sg and, to a lesser extent, his (as Koval suggested) Wp are unusually low for an Inquisitor. That doesn't show the kind of observation, decisiveness, learning and mental fortitude that is expected of one of the Emperor's Inquistion.

As for the shooting side of things - well, it's clear (if a bit clichéd) he's a completely close combat focused character. Leave it how you will.

Ok i have now taken your comments into consideration and have spaced out the backgound into loose paragraphs, as for his stat line here it goes:

                               WS BS  S    T   I   Wp  Sg  Nv  Ld
Inquisitor Ezekeel   78  51  76 73 60  70  57  85  75
Abilities: Leader and True Grit
Equipment: Power Hammer, Digital Laspistol, Robes everywhere except the head, Advanced Right Bionic Arm and Conversion Field

And as for being a cliche
isn't everything a cliche now since we try to avoid cliche which is making a cliche of its own
clichception...
:P

That seems better. Has his bionic arm got a defined strength (and armour, if appropriate)?

As for cliché, avoiding cliché is not cliché in of itself.

The thing is, a lot of close combat characters come with absolutely no ranged capability and it's almost invariably for one of the following two reasons: "Ranged weapons are dishonourable/less personal" or "He doesn't know how to use a gun". Both, but particularly the latter, often associated with characters from technologically backward worlds.

Neither really works for an Inquisitor. In the former case because so hindering yourself is going to make living long enough to become an Inquisitor unlikely (guns have displaced swords in combat for a reason) and in the latter because Inquisitors can't be that backward and still believably do their job.

As such, I'm not really that keen on the idea of a character who doesn't use guns at all.

I'd personally say his WS, S and T are still too high. WS could come down by about 5-10, the other two by about 10-15.

Let's take a look at that background the now as it slipped my mind earlier (even after I separated it all out for you). If it looks like ripping it apart, I used to be a teacher, and I'm also drinking, so what looks like overly harsh background-shredding probably isn't.

QuoteEzekeel first gained the attention of the inquisition at a young age as he led a loyalist uprising against a renegade PDF that had claimed control of the planet Craxis V, his fiery vigour and unshakable faith in the emperor guided the loyalists through the dark times and bitter fighting that ensued while they awaited the relief force that was promised to be coming. Instead of taking the year that was given, the relief force turned up 10 years into the conflict due to 'logistical errors' causing Ezekeel to become the not only the militaristic leader of uprising but also the spiritual guide for the remaining loyalists.

This bit's fine although we don't know much about this "renegade PDF" -- if you're going to describe the circumstances surrounding the reinforcements' delay, and what they found when they got there, perhaps a sentence or two about the PDF's secession and the "loyalist uprising" might be nice as well.

QuoteAfter the PDF had been crushed by the relief force he was quickly hunted down and offered a place in the personal retinue of Lord Inquisitor Irrus of the Ordo Hereticus to which he accepted almost instantly.

Not like he'd have had much choice in the matter.

QuoteHe quickly proved his worth in Irrus' retinue with his unshakable faith that the Emperor has a master plan and that when his time of death comes only then will he die, and even then he does not intend to go quietly. This ideology has caused him to fight past incredible pain as he strode through shootouts to crush his foes with his great hammer, on many accounts he had shrugged off grievous injuries that would have sent lesser men into pain induced comas.

There's more to being in an Inquisitor's retinue than being a zealot. In order to avoid sounding like a hundred other pious characters, I would place more emphasis on the skills he's offering to Irrus -- if religious fervour was all it took, then the Inquisition would be openly recruiting from Redemptionist movements and the Frateris Militia, with few others getting a word in edgeways. In any case he must've learned a few tricks if he managed to survive ten years of guerilla warfare against a secessionist military.

The way you've described his resilience seems a bit like shoehorning it in. I know you're trying to justify him having True Grit, but your description of him actually (and probably accidentally) puts him somewhere between a fanatic and a PCP junkie, if he's laughing off injuries that should've caused "pain-induced comas". Please tone down the hyperbole.

QuoteWhile in service of Irrus one of the greatest feats of his true grit

You really don't need to make the True Grit reference so glaringly obvious :P

Quotewas as Irrus had tracked down a smuggler who traded both alien and chaotic items, as the smuggler was running and the rest of the retinue was pinned from unseen marksmen, Ezekeel stormed across the open warehouse floor taking a serious sniper round through his left leg and into the small room in which the smuggler had taken cover.

In the interests of heading off another talk from Marco about the distinction between "marksman" and "sniper" in the underlined section, you could reword that as "a serious wound to his left leg". That way, we get the idea that he's been shot in the leg, and it's bad, but he's still moving (albeit slowly, as there's almost definitely muscle damage and possibly some injury to the bone as well). It also eliminates the possible misreading that the bullet literally went straight through his leg, in which case I don't know whether he'd even be able to move.

QuoteEzekeel engaged the smuggler in one on one combat in which the smuggler wielded a strange alien whip that caused tremendous pain upon contact (it was later identified to be a agoniser created in the black forges of the dark eldar).

You can get rid of the bracketed bit, not least because we all get the idea that it's an agoniser (though not all agonisers are whips, and not all agonisers are whips). Rewording it to "Ezekeel found himself engaged in melee with the smuggler, who wielded..." would also look a lot smoother.

I'd also like to take this opportunity to point out that most Eldar tech is unusable by non-Eldar -- Craftworlders employ psychic activation, whereas Dark Eldar tech probably uses gene-locks or something similar. Given that agonisers are likely to be highly personal pieces of kit, I can easily imagine that this smuggler would have been electrocuted before the agoniser would let him use it. Substituting the agoniser for a neural whip shouldn't be too problematic, as at least that thing's easier to acquire and use.

QuoteEzekeel finally brought the duel to an end by catching the whip with his left arm and dragged the heretic over to him before caving his head in with his trusty hammer.

I'm surprised his left arm isn't a bionic as well, if he's doing silly things like catching agonisers bare-handed.

QuoteIt was upon this event he was granted access to his now greatly feared Power Hammer that was picked from the stolen goods retaken from the smuggler.

I doubt an Interrogator would need to be "granted access" to something he takes for himself. You should use "acquired" here.

QuoteHe eventually gained his status of inquisitor through many more years of gruelling service to Irrus

You've glossed over the rest of his service entirely -- a misreading might lead to the assumption that he was made an Inquisitor for taking out a xenotech-smuggler. Please expand.

Quoteupon his title he was given a conversion field as a symbol of his status.

Conversion fields aren't really "symbols of status" in and of themselves. He could well be given one to mark the occasion, but you're creating the misconception that having a conversion field generator is an end result of becoming an Inquisitor.

QuoteHe has firmly believed that the heretic only truly perishes if you bleed the life from them with your own hands and so has dedicated his life to the art of melee combat

This is a really strange belief that looks like it's been tacked on solely to justify his high WS and Strength. Whatever happened to just being plain better in a fist fight than on the shooting range?

Quoteas well as building his strength through intense weight training, this has caused him to have the build of a weight lifter that many mistake for fat.

Having the equipment is not the same thing as knowing how to use it. Sure, he's a big old bruiser, but you've put more into describing why he's the size of a barn than you have into his actual melee training.

As a corollary to this, one of my own Inquisitors is built like a fridge, but he doesn't give a hoot about melee combat and spends all his time on the shooting range (when he's not in his bureau or drinking amasec, at least).

QuotePerhaps his greatest example of his sheer determination not to die was upon the moon of Ghorrus III on which he tracked down his old mentor Irrus who had turned from the Emperor's light

I'm sorry, but Irrus turning traitor is rather clichéd (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FallenHero) around these parts. At least Irrus dying didn't result in a Deathbed Promotion, I suppose.

Quotethey skirmished for days on end before finally meeting face to face on the great ash wastes that scarred the moon's surface.

This sounds like it's been lifted from any medieval-or-earlier movie and pasted poorly into 40K, particularly since you've also declined to describe any actual armies.

QuoteBoth warbands were truly destroyed in the clash

This bit feels rather clumsy. You've not described either Inquisitor having warbands up to this point, so the reader is left with a feeling of "oh wait, they had warbands? Wait, they died anyway, never mind, *shrug*"

Quotein which mentor fought pupil at the centre

The centre of what? Two piles of corpses?

Quotethe engagement ended when Irrus cleaved Ezekeel's right arm from his body at the shoulder.

Hang on a second. Ezekeel's previously been described as being able to shrug off traumatic injuries that would leave a man comatose...

QuoteAs he lay twisted Irrus savoured the moment of his 'victory' but as he turned his back and let out a roar of victory

Okay, so apparently turning traitor makes you stupid (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WhyDontYouJustShootHim)

QuoteEzekeel rose behind him with his severed arm clutched as a weapon and broke Irrus' back with a single swing of his arm before he preceded to pulp Irrus' head with a torrent of left hooks.

Unless Irrus is also physically quite frail I don't see much "pulping" going on -- killing him, certainly, but not quite so much head pulping, particularly when Ezekeel's losing loads of blood. Remember that there are a lot of blood vessels in the shoulder...

QuoteShortly after his victory Ezekeel was granted a robotic arm to enhance his already tremendous strength

The primary purpose of the bionic arm would be to replace his lost limb, surely.

Quotefrom that day on

These four words strung together in that order are just cliché.

QuoteEzekeel no longer fears death

Why?

Quoteand storms across the battlefield as any other man would dive to cover or be frozen in fear.

It is whispered that he is no longer sane or cares for his life

Again, why? If this is the end result of psychological scarring, this needs to be a bit clearer.

Quoteand the fire in his eyes in the crucible of combat proves to many.

Well, that would get the "suicidally brave" idea across, to be fair...

QuoteSo now Ezekeel roams the galaxy with his hardened retinue crushing his foes with his dreaded hammer and his hardened resolve.

"and they all lived happily ever after"
This sentence here isn't hugely necessary. We already get the idea that he's got a big hammer, and we already appreciate his "hardened resolve" -- do more with this earlier on, so that you don't have to tell us about it at the end. It also introduces a brand-new retinue, which can be done much better in individual character posts.


Again, if this comes across as harsh, it's not intentional; I really do just pick things apart these days.

First of all, please don't take this personal, I tend to be a bit critical because I want to help people avoid the mistakes that I made in te past.

Ruleswise, I would boost the sagicity somewhat, inquisitors tend to be very clever, they have to be to survive. Looking at the way you describe the inquisitor I would also give him some more bionics, maybe even some without rules but more for the aesthetics, he seem like someone who suffers lots of injuries.

About the background, I would try to give some more descriptions about his exploits, and I would take out the fights his master part. Even should the Inquisitor Lord turn renegade he would be immensely hard to find and lots of people would be after him. Also, it is a great cliche that one of my old characters also had. He could also have hunted down any other renegade without really changing the story. I would also try to make him seem a bit less suicidal, he takes many great risks about whic he should realize that they can only get him killed, and he should know that he is too important to die in stupid ways.

OK
here is Ezekeel's new background with 99% less cliche  :P

Ezekeel first gained the attention of the inquisition at a young age as he led a loyalist uprising against a renegade PDF that had claimed control of the planet Craxis V, his fiery vigour and unshakable faith in the emperor guided the loyalists through the dark times and bitter fighting that ensued while they awaited the relief force that was promised to be coming. Instead of taking the year that was given, the relief force turned up 10 years into the conflict due to 'logistical errors' causing Ezekeel to become the not only the militaristic leader of uprising but also the spiritual guide for the remaining loyalists. Upon the arrival of the relief force they found the PDF were being pushed back by a tide of zealous civilians and when the relief forces aided Ezekeel's forces they made short work of the renegades.

After the PDF had been crushed by the relief force he was quickly hunted down and drafted into the personal retinue of Lord Inquisitor Irrus of the Ordo Hereticus to which he felt greatly honoured. He quickly proved his worth in Irrus' retinue with his unshakable faith that the Emperor has a master plan and that when his time of death comes only then will he die, and even then he does not intend to go quietly. This ideology has caused him to fight past incredible pain as he strode through shootouts to crush his foes with his great hammer, on many accounts he had shrugged off grievous injuries that would have sent lesser men into shock. Through his service under Irrus he quickly learned that although his comrades would cover him as he grappled with the enemy face to face he would in turn need to occasionally fire back and so began to train in the basic use of fire arms.

While in service of Irrus one of the greatest feats of endurance was during a conflict in which Irrus had tracked down a smuggler who traded both alien and chaotic items, as the smuggler was running and the rest of the retinue was pinned from unseen marksmen, Ezekeel stormed across the open warehouse floor taking a serious sniper round through his left calf which brought him to a slow trudge into the small room in which the smuggler had taken cover. Ezekeel engaged the smuggler in one on one combat in which the smuggler wielded a strange alien whip that caused tremendous pain upon contact. Ezekeel finally brought the duel to an end by catching the whip with his left arm and dragged the heretic over to him before caving his head in with his trusty hammer. It was upon this event Irrus deemed it time to provide his favoured acolyte with a Power Hammer to better smite his foes.

He eventually gained his status of inquisitor when Irrus had led his warband to purge a corrupted cathedral in which he was separated from the rest of the warband and cut through swathes of mutants into the antechamber in which he confronted the arch heretic. Their conflict ended as the arch heretic was mid possession in which Ezekeel threw him through a stained glass window and down into the rocky outcrops that surrounded the cathedral below. Upon his title he was given a conversion field in the form of a inquisitorial seal shaped necklace as a symbol of his status. He began to dedicate his spare time to building his strength through intense weight training that has caused him to have the build of a weight lifter that many mistake for fat.

In a conflict against incredibly poisonous reptiles while hunting down the rogue inquisitor Parthos upon the death world of Jargus III he received multiple bites down his right arm and so to avoid the horrific death awaiting by the slow moving toxins he removed his right arm with his own hammer to avoid death. This event has caused him to think far more about whether to charge into the fray or to hang back and return fire, but once the enemy closes in on him they quickly feel the heat from the flames of righteousness that burn within his soul.

Shortly after his extraction Ezekeel was granted a robotic arm to enhance his already tremendous strength which he soon put into good use as he now continues to hunt Parthos down.

Better, could still do with a bit of stylistic tightening up but them's the breaks.

I'm still wondering how Ezekeel still has his left arm, as if we're still going down the agoniser/neural whip route, we're looking at sustained electrical damage to his nerves and muscles. Imperial medical science is good, but not so good that it can just fix an electrically fried arm.

You may want to take a look at this link (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DestinationDefenestration) for the cathedral scene -- needless to say, chucking someone through a window would be quite horrendous in and of itself, possession or not. I can't imagine that whatever was trying to possess this poor sod had a pleasant time of it, although I can imagine Irrus scratching his head as his clean-up crew tries to deal with the horrible red fleshy smear on the ground.

QuoteUpon his title he was given a conversion field in the form of a inquisitorial seal shaped necklace as a symbol of his status.

While the Inquisitorial rosette can be made into a pendant, it's just quicker to say he was given a pendant containing a conversion field generator (maybe even a rosarius of some kind?) and avoids the strangeness of fancy rosettes having field generators in them.

Couple of things about your lizards here: "incredibly poisonous" and "slow-moving toxins" may not always match up in everyone's minds (although it's certainly possible), so you could avert a possible misreading just by dropping the word "incredibly". While we're at it, removing your own arm with a hammer is not an easy task, even given that Ezekeel has one with a disruptor field, though I suppose the disruptor field makes it "feasible" rather than "incredibly messy, ineffective, and painful".

Quote from: Koval on August 26, 2012, 07:57:13 PMI'd personally say his WS, S and T are still too high. WS could come down by about 5-10, the other two by about 10-15.

Those stats in the 70s for a character who specialises in close combat and is built like the proverbial aren't out of place.

To use a character you are familiar with as an example, Silva is WS 72, S 70 (or S 95 with her bionics) and T 73... plus blessed with a better BS value too.
But, on the flipside, she's one of my more powerful characters, doesn't have the other commitments that an Inquisitor does and does have reasons behind it. (Basically, her being a decent shot comes from a time before her bionics directly and indirectly gave her quite such strength. She didn't forget how to - or not use - a gun because she was learning how to cope with/capitalise on her newfound weight and power).
I'd also add that she doesn't benefit from such equipment as a power hammer, conversion field and True Grit.

It may work out or it may not - but you can't really say until some games have been played. I think it's a feasible starting point, anyway.

The 70s bit isn't so much the problem as the mid-to-high-70s bit, though. Ezekeel could stand to lose 5 from each stat and he'd still convey the idea that he's an absolute bruiser.

It's not all that possible to critique the finer points of S & T stats without knowing the model.

The strongest non-bionic/superhuman character from my collection is currently Markus Karlmunn, based on the 28mm great weapon Wood Elf Highborn. As his model, once cured of its bandy legged pose and elfin waist (http://i772.photobucket.com/albums/yy3/MarcoSkoll/Inq28/Inq28-WIP/IMG_4935.jpg), comes in at a scale height of seven feet and very heavily built, he consequently sports S83 and T80.

If he had a smaller miniature, it'd be less, even if (in character) he'd put the same sum effort into developing his build.

That's fair enough, but I still think it's a bit much for a first character.

It could be a bit too much, but such things also depend on the people Ezekeel games with and of course on what sort of companions the inquisitor has. The thing that I fear more than his stats is the power hammer, those can be very, very painful in my experience.

Maybe i should clarify what i'm up against and who Ezekeel will be accompanied by:
His intended retinue consists of a inquisitorial storm trooper with a sniper and possibly a sanctioned psyker
Obviously these two will have far lower scores than him to even out the playing field
and as for what i'm up against
for definite 1 guy will be using a space marine with stats as seen in the rulebook and the others i'm not so sure
 

It would be worth having a word with your group.

As we've already said, 11 years of play have shown better grounded characters provide a more mutually rewarding and satisfying play experience - when actions aren't playing out 80%+ chances of hits and damage rolls likely to be in the 20s, encounters have far more potential to go either way rather than being dependent on who gets to take their turn first.

I would also say that it's shown the importance of the co-operative and considerate approach, but that really should be apparent from the start (although evidently often isn't). If you have complete freedom in character creation, "winning" because you were less restrained is completely unrewarding for all players involved and proves nothing.

On the note of Space Marines specifically - I absolutely believe that Space Marines should appear in Inquisitor.
They're a very iconic part of the 40k universe and a force which the Inquisition (or their enemies!) can resort to in times of need.

However, it should definitely be said that Space Marines are front line shock troopers - and utterly wasted on any role that lesser forces could achieve.

There are not enough Space Marines to spare that they can be dispatched for casual investigation (or go on a personal quest to atone for some past failure, which is probably in the top 10 of "Inquisitor character background clichés") - particularly seeing as walking around in bright blue armour tends to give anyone you're looking for advance warning you're in the area.

Exactly why is he playing a Space Marine? Is it because he has an interesting character idea which actually adds something to the narrative and will be fun for all involved?* Or is it because it's as hard as nails?

*Other than as a GM, I've played only one Space Marine in the last few years - his personality had the potential to clash interestingly with the other Marines in the Deathwatch based narrative that was running at the time. Sure, he was a badass - but that was a requirement rather than the point.

There was a fan-made revision of Space Marines a while ago that brought their stats in line with common sense -- they're still nails, and the various implants all do something different (which actually makes them more powerful), but the revision's designed so that their statline doesn't break the system in ways it's not meant to be broken.

Pretty much what Koval said. The system really doesn't handle 100+ stats well, and the Dark Magenta rules do a lot to deal with that (even if their Strength values still tend to hang around S130 in power armour, that's at least less than 100 per arm). It works a lot better, even if as an end result they end up possibly more powerful than the rulebook. (What with the ability to ignore stunned results and the like).

That doesn't however really justify the validity of a Marine though. There needs to be, as with any character, valid reason for them to be present in the game.

That is something with which I completely agree, Space Marines and the like have no place in this game, unfortunately however, the original rulebook did include them because they are seen as an essential part of the universe. This, combined with the very powerful characters presented in the rulebook, has led to the belief that characters should be of such a power level. And as a matter of fact, they have to be in many cases. The moment someone in a group takes characters of such a power level the other players are almost forced to follow, or there has to be a talk about it. It is a narrative game, yes, but most people don't really enjoy having their characters stomped into the ground by much more powerful beings.

The only way to stop this is to have a group-wide conversation with the aim of establishing a desired power level. The outcome of this can vary widely between groups. Here on the Conclave we have established a standard which is low and weak compared to the rulebook which is the result of years of experience with the game, and the belief that 'weaker' characters make for more interesting games.

Quote from: Dolnikan on August 30, 2012, 12:28:40 PM...because they are seen as an essential part of the universe.

Heck, I think they are. Where would the game be without the possibility of a Traitor Marine as the Big Bad or the Deathwatch/Grey Knight ready to aid the assault on the xeno/daemon cult?

I think Space Marines have a completely justified place in Inquisitor. However, it is a much narrower one than Inquisitors/Rogue Traders/Techpriests/etc and their henchmen enjoy.

They are an essential part, but not as big as they are often seen to be. To many people it is almost a must to have a marine, it would have been better if the main rules had said something about them not being supposed to show up all that often.