Now, this may be the Dark Heresy territory (i think...), but i was recently thinking about adding a group of Vampyres for a campaign i was thinking of hosting, based around the idea that there are some old school vampyres (yeah, with a Y), running around wreaking havok and generally tearing things up. All done with style of course. The story is in its infancy at the minute, as to whether they will be contagious, or a mutant strain, or even a particular "species" of daemon. I'm not sure which was i'd go just yet, someone did suggest that they should literally be Vampyres, with all the bells and whistles, and have just survived throughout the millenia. It just so happens that one particularly ambitious one has chosen to start taking over, which opened the possibility of loyalty questions (another side of puritan vs radical), and using Vampyres from a different clan/caste/family in order to bring down the ones who're kicking up a fuss.
The inspiration has been various different sources, Bram Stoker's Dracula and Jasper Kent's Twelve (and the sequel 13 Years Later, though im only halfway through) in particular for that "charming son of a gun" idea, alongside the super strength aspect and tough as nails kinda feel. If anyone could reccomend any other sources to look at, i'd appreciate it.
I was considering using the Standard Inquisitor Template (SIT), to represent these are more than normal people, however, i figured that'd make the Bog Standard Imperial Citizen ridiculously clever, so instead i'm just going to use that SIT as an example of how i'd see an Acolyte, an Inquisitor, and an Inquisitor Lord if they were Vampyres, by which i mean the improvement to stats, and the reduced stats. I think these bonus' would apply to every class depending on which they were turned into.
The first class would be the Minions, the lower caste and only recently turned at that. They would effectively be the Acolyte build of the SIT, they'd be recently turned, yet wouldn't fully comprehend their own abilities. Their stats would be -
Minion -
WS =75 - 2D6
BS = 65 - 2D6
S = 60 + 2D6
T = 60 + 2D6
I = 70 + 2D6
WP = 75 - 2D10
SG = 75 - 2D10
NV = 75 - 2D10
LD = 75 - 2D10
This represents the fact they're only getting used to the recent change, and aren't in full control of their powers. They've dumber than normal due to the increased amount of sensory intake, yet they're stronger and tougher than usual, but not yet fully developed.
Vampyre - This is someone who has been a vampyre for a while, they're used to their powers, and are fully able to use them. However, they're not from a "higher caste", they're pretty much the mid ranking ones, they're good for muscle, and can control the minions, yet they're not devastating.
WS = 85
BS = 75
S = 65 + 2D10
T = 65 + 2D10
I = 80 + 2D10
WP = 85 - 2D6
SG = 85 - 2D6
NV = 85 - 2D6
LD = 85 - 2D6
Again, they're not as smart as normal people from their class, but again, they're meant to be leading the lower ranks, in pairs or in a small group, they're not meant to be the brains of the operations.
Vampyre Lord
WS = 95
BS = 85
S = 70 + 2D10
T = 70 + 2D10
I = 90 + 2D10
WP = 85 + D6
SG = 95 + D6
Nv = 95 + D6
Ld = 95 + D6
Effectively the End Boss, the improvement across the board implies a certain "animal cunning" that makes him smarter than his contemporary class' (an Inquisitor Lord in this case), but they are meant to be hard as nails, and then some.
Also, each one would have a combined "Vampirism and Regenerate" (you can't regenerate without using vampirism on someone), and a Cloak of Darkness that they can control with a willpower test, meaning that they CAN go out in sunlight (ala Dracula), but they have to concentrate to do so. I also feel that non of them should be able to be psychers, though the Lord character has a choice between EITHER having the Entrance power (though without the daemonic side effects), or Fearsome. This represents the idea that they can be beautiful, or terrifying, but never both.
As for weapons, and armour, i feel that they shouldn't really go above Common, the idea being that they thrive in backwater planets, and having anything better than the local equivalent is both risky, and unnessecary (they're basically monster ninjas, if they need gunz then you're doing it wrong :o :o).
As for the campaign, the idea would be scary Alien/horror movie style. All darkened, narrow corridors, and empty cities, deserted by the fact the locals fear the "monsters. It would be the few Inquisitors trying to hunt down the Vampyre Lord, and eliminate him, or at least try to. Again, im only into the initial stages of planning, so these ideas are open to pretty much ANY help whatsoever.
Modelwise, i was looking at a few, the Lord would be a Pizzazo model, (http://www.pizarrominiaturas.com/tienda/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=1), it's understated but shadowy as well, i like it...
As for the others, theres been a few i've been looking at, Enigma, Masterclass and Andrea in particular. However, i feel i'd have to add some 40kishness to them, as they're all pretty much barbarians, and whilst this kinda works, i'd need to add some 40k bits and bobs to give them that 40k feel we all know and love.
Soooo, what do y'all reckon? I could do with a little help...
You should have a look for the Codex: Dark Imperium - a previous attempt to bring vampires into the 40k universe which might give you a few ideas...
Or look at the entry for vampires in Rogue Trader (the original, not the new RPG).
Oh, my word - we've gone back in time about six years.
Like Kaled says, look here for all sorts of Conclave-created goodness: http://www.sacemoth.net/inqfiles/codexdarkimperium.pdf (http://www.sacemoth.net/inqfiles/codexdarkimperium.pdf)
Vampire-threads have a habit of being hard to kill off...
There we go, i knew it was called something, i thought it was Dark Heresy, not Dark Imperium. I like it, i'll be able to give it a more thorough read through tomorrow, when im not up in 5 hours. The one thing that'd be different however would be the idea that it's only a small group, not the entire Imperium. Of course it wouldn't be hard to copy and paste some of the rules.
As for the Original Rogue Trader, does anyone know where i'd be able to find the vampire rules from it?
Well, Vampires in the 41st millenium are pretty cool (as long as they don't sparkle). But I'm thinking the stat guide may be a little high, even for turned Inquisition agents. Had a brief look at the Dark Imperium book, looks interesting.
I'm going to be perfectly honest, having a direct vampyre translation into Inquisitor never really jived with my vision of the 40K. That said, it's been a very long time since I've read of the dark imperium article.
IMO I think there are just so many different ways to represent vampyre-like creatures out there that there's no reason to have a direct analog (for instance, some type of vaguely alien race like the creatures from Mortarion's old planet, powerful chaos mages, or even the Dark Eldar, as a shameless plug you should all read my Cabal of the Wick Fate post! http://www.the-conclave.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=583.0 (http://www.the-conclave.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=583.0)). All of these are great excuses to have vampyre like creatures and you can even go so far as to call them vampyres (and even make your own ordo around it) as I think the study of creatures who suck the life force from other beings to survive could be of particular interest to the Inquisitor, say the Thorians (they certainly have a delectably undead leader who they'd love to revive by any-means-necessary...)
Anyway, rant off.
Why are vampires perceived as being cooler with a "y"?
R.
Quote from: precinctomega on March 23, 2010, 04:15:30 PMWhy are vampires perceived as being cooler with a "y"?
I always thought Vampyres would be better taken as an instruction for what to do if you caught one. ;D
It looks old european, which ignores that the letter I is older in the Latin alphabet than the letter y. Also, the first successful vampire novel was John Polidori's The Vampyre. In Serbian it's Vampir though, and a Transylvanian would say Strigoi.
Uhmmm... Personally, the idea of the RT Vampire seems most fitting. They don't convert, but they do enslave
QuoteWhy are vampires perceived as being cooler with a "y"?
The same reason Orks are cooler with a "K" :P
In all seriousness though, I think it's literally just so we don't have exact replicas of fantasy races in 40K, which (as arbitrary as it is) I'm kind of okay with.
To expand upon the point I was - obliquely - driving at (and which Alyster Wick has touched upon), there is plenty of room in the existing 40k canon for vampire-like creatures/people without having to directly import Bram Stoker's Dracula.
Haemovore cults are specifically referenced in the LRB. Star Vampires appeared in the 40k 1st Editon. Karloth Valois (in Necromunda) taps the whole "creatures of the night" vibe. Etc.
Anyone lurching out of a showing of the latest Twilight movie, desperate for vampires as pseudohuman monsters that rip bloody chunks out of people's throats and burst into flames in the full glare of daylight is well-advised to tap the theme for inspiration fitting to the 40kverse as opposed to simply performing a direct cut and paste of an archetype from one universe into another.
R.
For me it's a pronounciation thing, Vapire is spelt the traditional way, Vampyre is pronouced like VampEAR, kinda like how i'd imagine ye olde Vald to say it.
True there is, though i wanted to shy away from the bloody chunks thing, and though i'd like them to be able to do that, i wanted them to be far more dangerous. The idea i was thinking of would be the temptation that all Vampires seem to have, that kinda attraction people have to them. It would be similar to the temptation that Chaos has, yet due to the fact it's not necessarily "wrong", it'd be more of a problem for the Inquisition to deal with, as there's nothing wrong with becoming one.
Quote from: JoelMcKickass on March 24, 2010, 02:08:23 PM
as there's nothing wrong with becoming one.
Depends on who you ask. There are plenty of people in the Imperium who believe that any deviation from the 'blessed purity of the human form' is inherently blasphemous and thus is deserving of only one thing: to be killed with fire.
Just to throw in my 2 cents I think that Vampyre as a term is fine to describe a subset of beings who survive as aggressive parasites (consuming souls, energy, blood, etc) and could cover anything from mutants, haemovores, heretics, aliens (dark eldar and others) and even daemon hosts.
As such it makes perfect sense that an inquisitor might specialize in them, if not as a specific ordos then at least as a subset of the other 3. As I said before, Thorians would definitely be interested in methods of transfering power from the living to the "dead" for purposes of resurrection.
Quote from: JoelMcKickass on March 24, 2010, 02:08:23 PMThe idea i was thinking of would be the temptation that all Vampires seem to have, that kinda attraction people have to them.
Only if you're reading modern versions of Vampires. Portraying Vampires/Werewolves/other supernatural beings in a more positive light has only really come about in the last half century.
Given the Grimdark themes of 40k, I don't really think that "positive" vampires really belong. If portrayed as some kind of Xenos or Chaos warped creatures that are universally feared and have no compassion for those they prey on, then that would fit... but the idea of them being a temptation to any but those who would crave Chaos isn't one that works for me.
"If portrayed as some kind of Xenos or Chaos warped creatures that are universally feared and have no compassion for those they prey on, then that would fit..."
That'd be the way i'd want the lower ranks to appear, yet it would be the same attraction that politicians and leaders have to Slaanesh. They know it's wrong, yet they still can't help by be enthralled (the exact word i was looking for) by it. Though they would definately be the antagonists in the campaign. Whilst people would be attracted to them, they wouldn't have a single redeemable quality.
"Depends on who you ask. There are plenty of people in the Imperium who believe that any deviation from the 'blessed purity of the human form' is inherently blasphemous and thus is deserving of only one thing: to be killed with fire"
"The Blood of Martyr's is the Seed of the Imperium", from the LRB. It could be something of a defence for a loyalist Vampire (who can't understand why people don't like him killing people, kinda like the Flesh Tearers), who believes that by consuming the blood, he is infact keeping it alive. Or something.
Having a Thorian trying to examine one (much like a mad scientist) would be an interesting idea...
Any body here head of a chapter called the Blood Angels?
Anybody here heard of the Black Rage?
Now, IIRC, if prevented from charging gloriously into battle, a Blood Angel aflicted with the Black Rage lapses into a state known as the Red Thirst. In which case, they become utterly feral, desiring only to feed on the warm blood of their fellow men. These Blood Angels are restrained by their brothers until their inevitable (and usual rapid) death by physical trauma as they attempt to struggle out of their bonds.
Suppose such a creature were to escape.
Now, we know that the blood of sanguinary priests is used to get a cerain amount of genetic material into blood angels neophytes- this is in part what causes the chapter's degeneration. What if our escaped blood angel were to spill his blood apon one of his victims, effectively gifting said victim with a portion of Sanguiniouses nature, and passing on the red thirst to him as well? This will probably be accidental at first, but soon he will realise the potential for a cult of equally bloodthirsty followers...
Potential warband:
Brother Guilamant, our escaped Blood Angel. An astartes with no armour and only basic equipment. He possibly loses some skills, and gains Vampirism. for d6 turns after he has used vampirism, he benefits from Regenerate and Heroic.
Gryle, Guilamant's first victim to survive. Hideously scarred. Has Vamprirism et al, as well as WP and NV apropriate to an astartes, representing the Blood Angels heretidge in his blood.
Lenore, Guilamant's most recent victim. Uses Severina/sevora figure, perhaps? Infiltrater. usual vampirey abilities.
Hell, I may have to make this warband myself...
I suppose there are two catagories of vampire. The first, broader one is humans or creatures who drink blood for whatever reason, and the second is supernatural creatures that possess several of the classic vampiric traits: dependence on blood to survive, reaction with sunlight (usualy a violent reaction), a resiliance to most forms of death, weakness to holyness and maybe even the ability to turn into a bat or a swarm of bats.
I think there is plenty of room for the former. Blood angels are a previously mensioned example, elitist haemovores who favour vampirism over cannibalism also exist and I'm sure there are Khornate and Slaneeshi vampire cults.
The latter, I think, are plauable only as a breed of daemon, or possibly victims of a daemonic virus, and thus would be present in imperial society hardly more than plague zombies.
As to how to represent chaos virus vampires, I'd say the daemonic impervious exotic ability and the vampirism exotic ability, then perhaps invunerability and cloak of darkness too. It might also to be appropriate to count them as having a gland of psycon (no dose limit). But otherwise they should not gain skill or abilities over humans.
I think i'm going to go with the Xenos idea, and after looking around i've seen some models i could use for them. I really like the idea they've got Glands, it doesn't make them immensely strong, but it does give them an edge.
As for abilities, i can't shrug the idea they could control Cloak of Darkness, pass a willpower test and its not active, so they can walk around, fail it and they explode in a spectacular fashion, or catch fire in the head and arms kinda way. Hell, i'd like it if psykers could nullify that badboy, it'd make it pretty funny...
I like keeping the same stats are normal, makes it less complex, so to put it in full: Psychon Gland, Cloak of Darkness, and Vampirism/Regeneration, anything else?
Just to clarify, these would be NPC's controlled by the GM, or whomever wasn't taking part in that battle in the campaign. My idea has sort of solidified into a group of Inquisitors are investigating rumours of them. A Hereticus is investigating rumours of Heretics, Malleus investigating rumours of a Daemon running rampant, and Xenos have heard that there's an Alien subset that's being worshipped.
There's even a philosophical side to things, Thorians wanting to find someway to extend their life (or bring back the Emperor), Recongregators trying to use the Vampires as a way to destabilise a planetary government (perfect Assassins?), Monodominants wanting to wipe them out, you get the drift.
If you are running them as aliens then I'd say cloak of darkness, as a daemonic power, is inappropriate. I'd also argue that they shouldn't be too human, I'd make their hands into great claws, and say that they double over to run on all four limbs. I wouldn't apply regeneration either, as vamprism already has a healing affect.
Quote from: MarcoSkoll on March 26, 2010, 02:49:15 AM
Only if you're reading modern versions of Vampires. Portraying Vampires/Werewolves/other supernatural beings in a more positive light has only really come about in the last half century.
Erm. Sorry Marco that's not entirely accurate.
Dracula was published in 1897. 113 years ago.
Count Dracula. The entire novel can be read to represent the fear in society of the female orgasm/ sexualisation. Dracula can be seen to represent love, lust, animal power and incredible social magnestism. Indeed the male characters themselves produce passages with homosexual undertones regarding the count.
the Vampyre, by Polidori was publised in 1819. 191 years ago.
Lord Ruthven is a suave gentleman vamypre and a powerful seducer.
I think Joel is accurate in his depiction of Vampires as attractive figures of temptation. That
IS, to my mind at least, one of the major archetypes they hold in western literature.
:)
Adam
Quote from: Adam Cunis on April 12, 2010, 09:56:44 PMDracula was published in 1897. 113 years ago.
Hmm.
Yes, Vampires have long had the power of seduction. But that's attraction
to a Vampire. What I'm talking about is the attraction of BEING a vampire, which the idea Joel is running with.
While wanting to be a vampire might come about if a Vampire has seduced you into wanting to stay with him/her forever, having developed an attraction to becoming a vampire of your own accord would require that you saw being a vampire as being a good thing.
And largely, vampires have only really been portrayed as the kind of figure that someone (vaguely sane) might reasonably like to be in more modern fiction. Comparatively, Dracula is not likely to have been a figure that many people 113 years ago would have wanted to follow in the footsteps of.
That's what I was talking about.
Well. I've always seen vampires for the 40k setting as being either daemons or a form of xenos, rather than the relatively new, fairly common "people with a virus that makes them appear dead and be allergic to sunlight and other things" idea.
As a daemon, I'd imagine them to be a slaaneshi daemon, sort of like a succubus, but instead of taking a man's . . . seed, they take their blood. This would represent the alluring side to vampires pretty well, in my opinion.
As a xenos, I think of them as nocturnal creatures, which are very tall and spindly looking, with claws, fangs, pointed ears, the whole "bestial vamp" shaboosh. They might burn very easily, quickly and painfully when exposed to sunlight. These could more represent the "hunter in the night" side of vampires.
And, yeah, I reckon that most people, even oppressed citizens in 40k, would not want to become either of those things.
I don't think you need to create a supernatural 'race' of vampires, or even a xenos race. There are lots of reasons why hematophagy hasn't evolved in large animals.
The old Rogue Trader energy-feeders and the crazier Blood Angels succesor-chapters probably aren't what you're looking for, but a simple daemonically-possessed or chaos-tainted individual could well fit the vampiric mould, and as has been mentioned, plenty of cults have blood drinking habits already.
Perhaps some implant special fangs, possibly with venom-sacs in the mouth for soporific poisons, with crude eye replacements designed to see by night but sadly vulnerabe to daylight. That allows a non-supernatural vampire, and they could induct new members easily enough to swell their ranks.
If taking the supernatural route, I wouldn't recomend vampirism being contagious in the tradition sense, but possibly your chaos-vampire would induct others by use of nasty rituals or, if taking the daemonic route, a specialised form of possession.
Though you prefer a Slaaneshi approach, I'm surprised nobody's suggested a Khornate vampire. He is the Blood God, after all. Though such a being is less likely to be seductive and subtle. And there's always chaos undivided.
Sargoth we weren't talking today were we?
I was in my LGW and mentioned the idea, someone simply pointed out that Plague Zombies are Nurgles minions, what about a Khornate equivalent for Vampires (we then went into a bit debate about what would they actually be, Vampires or some form of Werewolf equivalent, and so on and so forth), and someone pointed it out earlier in the thread, have them as a form of plague zombie, just abused by another god. We kinda went of topic then about using Space Marines, but that led onto me not buying any of the new Blood Angels stuff.
However, it did bring up the original variation of the Plague Zombie thing, which does seem quite interesting, and means they can have daemonic powers, however, i wouldn't want to have variations of the same idea for the 4 Gods.
So, each chaos god gets a sort of 'infected' human thingy.
Nurgle gets plague zombies
Slaanesh gets Lahmia type vampires
Khorne gets Strigoi tyoe vampires
Tzeench gets... what? Yet more mutants? Ghosties?
Personally, one thing I've always found interesting* with vampires is their 'no longer human' schtick. The idea that they become imortal and powerful, but lose their humanity. This does tie in quite nicely with space marines. When we factor in the general awesomeness of Marines and the potential for genetic degeneration to give them various quirks and weaknesses, I'd say a pretty good vampire-standin could be made from an Astartes.
After all, it strikes me that 'chaos did it' is something of a cop-out aproach to coming up with nasties in 40k.
*before twilight got to it. After that it was pretty hard to take seriously.