Hi. I've been thinking of building a model from scratch for a little while but have been putting off while I pluck up the courage. The other day I finally decided to take the plunge and built myself an armiture and started bulking it out. here the progress so far.
(http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk146/Maverick19985/DSC00261.jpg)
Tried to keep everything in proportion as best I can.
Regards T.
Although I'm not neccessarily in a position to judge, it looks good so far to me. I look forward to seeing it progress. What's your eventual plan for it, what's the concept you're working towards?
Everything looks as if it is properly proportioned to me.
Are you going to sculpt the head/hands/weapons, or use ready made bits?
I may sound a little harsh with this post, but I don't mean to be. I've learnt the hard way how important anatomical correctness is in art (both drawing and sculpting), and I'm trying to avoid you having to go through quite so many mistakes I have.
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Firstly - on your model the Torso is the same length as the legs. In reality, the legs are longer than the torso. Basic proportions are as follows...
Overall, the human body is about 7.5 heads tall. Going down from the top:
- The chin is at the first head length (obviously).
- The top of the shoulders (collar bone) at about 1.5 heads down.
- Nipples 2 heads down.
- Navel 3 heads down
- Division of the legs 4 heads down. (As are the wrists, if the arms are held to the sides.)
- Knees a little lower than 5 heads down.
- Ankles about 7.2 heads down.
- Soles of the feet, 7.5 heads down.
As you can tell, that makes the Torso about 2.5 head lengths, and the legs 3.5 head lengths - a little less than half as long again as the torso.
I'm sorry to say that it's a bit hard to sort that kind of thing after you've done the basic shaping (the only option may be to start over), but if you proceed as it is, it'll never be able to look right, because the model's crotch will be incredibly low.
Typically, I make my armatures with the crotch about half the way up the total height of the body - while a fraction high, this gives room to build up layers of putty over the crotch, and besides, slightly long legs look better than short ones.
You don't have to do the same, but it works well for me.
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Secondly - there isn't enough bulk in the legs. To demonstrate, stand upright for a moment with both your feet together.
Notice how there's almost no space between your legs? Given your body doesn't suddenly narrow at the pelvis, this means the upper legs have about half the width of the torso (which is usually about a head length and a quarter wide)
Your legs do thin on the way down, and the gap between them (across the crotch) does increase when the legs are apart (due to the shape of the femur) but standing like this model is, you need to build up the bulk on the inner thighs, and reduce the gap between the legs somewhat.
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Thirdly - I can't really tell from that photo, but it looks like the torso is too thin. The ribcage and pelvis are about three-quarters of the head length thick. From the side, the abdomen tends to curve slightly out between the ribcage and the pelvis at the front, but the small of the back does of course dip in.
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You'll notice that I've used the "head length" measurement quite a lot. Although the head isn't usually the first stage of a model, working out how big it's going to be IS. Take the planned model height, and divide by 7.5.
Now, all of the above is based on realistic proportions. With heroic proportions (which you don't have to use), everything gets bulked up further.
I don't personally work to heroic proportion, so I can't give exact figures, but the body is about 6 heads high, with most thicknesses (although not lengths) scaling with that larger head, and the crotch still at about half the total height of the model.
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Sorry to come along and provide you with a short lecture on anatomy, but that's where most of the problems here lie. Your actual technique and putty control are excellent, but the basic body shape is the most important part in getting a sculpt to look right.
Get the anatomy right, and it becomes pretty hard to end up with a bad model. Get it wrong, and it becomes very hard to end up with a good model. Sure, a misproportioned model might look alright at first glance, but over time, it'll slowly begin to look off as the difference between what you thought you sculpted and what you have sculpted begins to become apparent.
I've had to work hard to learn to see what I have sculpted/drawn (rather than what I think I have), and I've also had to spend time learning what I should be sculpting/drawing as well. Neither comes particularly easily, but once you've got them, they're very valuable artistic skills.
I cant comment on your sculpt (Marco's excellent advice does that) apart that for a first attempt - wow! very nice, and Im looking forward to seeing your progress.
I am pleased to see that Conclave members occasional rise beyond the cheapo rot-gut I tend to buy, and use a better class of cork for thier base - a certain popular Spanish cava if Im not mistaken...
Wow thanks for the replies everyone. and thank Marcoskoll for the advice.
@ Marcoskoll - Most the things you picked up on can be fixed in my opinion. Since he will be wearing a tunic I willl be able to make the legs look longer. I agree the legs and torso are a little thin but this was intentional also as I will be sculpting cloths on top thus bulking out further. I hope your posts will be as candid as I progress because if this sculpt turns out ok I have plans for more and you only improve my making mistakes.
@ Kaled - At this stage I paln to scuplt the hands and head myself. Since this project is a learning curve I think this is a must.
Progress since yesterday:
(http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk146/Maverick19985/DSC00264.jpg)
Not 100% happy with boots, However I am endevouring to fix them.
Thanks alot everyone.
Regards T.
Quote from: Tessio Niri on April 28, 2010, 04:55:44 PMSince he will be wearing a tunic I will be able to make the legs look longer.
While you can cover some sins that way, I wouldn't rely on it in future. Time spent on getting the basic body shape right is the most important time you can spend.
QuoteI agree the legs and torso are a little thin but this was intentional also as I will be sculpting cloths on top thus bulking out further.
That's not actually really necessary. If you take clothes, they're usually only a few millimetres thick, so almost imperceptibly thin on a model of this scale - more precise than I ever was sorting the basic anatomy.
What I personally do is to sculpt the basic shape of the model (which the clothes have to conform to) and then when that's done, use putty to add in just the areas where the clothes hang away from the skin. Creases, baggy areas, loose fits, cuffs, seams/pockets, covering up muscle definition - that sort of thing. I don't build up any layers over the rest of the skin.
A good sequence is to sculpt the things that will define the position of other parts first.
To me, that means basic skeletal structure of torso and legs, then all the muscle structure of the same before moving on to other layers. Body fat (female breasts included*) and clothes have to be ordered on a case by case basis, as they're often defined by each other, but it's not too hard to work them out.
*Male ones too, if you're doing that kind of model.Of course, any method comes down to personal taste, but I started with the "sculpt a new layer of clothing over everything" approach and changed to what I now do because I find it much less work and easier to get the right bulk in the limbs.
QuoteAt this stage I plan to sculpt the hands and head myself. Since this project is a learning curve I think this is a must.
A couple of tips for faces...
While the basic techniques I use for the face were originally based on this article (http://www.one-ring.co.uk/phpBB2/kb.php?mode=article&k=91), my big piece of advice is work over an already hardened blob of putty - the fact that there's actually some solidity to what you're working on is invaluable. The other is to ONLY do the face and forehead when working. Leave the shaping of the rest of the head and the addition of hair for after the face has hardened.
Looking very good for a first attempt! I wouldn't expect to produce anything looking that well shaped on my own first try.
This does make me want to give sculpting a go myself.
Quote from: Kavey on April 29, 2010, 01:58:00 AMThis does make me want to give sculpting a go myself.
I recommend at least trying. As Lao-Tzu said, a journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
If it doesn't work out, then at least you know. If it does work out, then you started all the sooner.
You're on a forum full of experienced modellers (as well as some numpties like me ;)), so you're not exactly short of people who can give you advice if you get into trouble.
I tried, and I didn't exactly regret the decision. My drawing experience did help, as it gave me some knowledge* of anatomy and proportion, but then again, that's the kind of thing people can help with if you need.
*Admittedly, not necessarily perfectly applied knowledge.