Hey there all, I'm new to conclave and relatively new to inquisitor. I've had the rule book since I was about 15 (now 20) but having been distracted by boobs mainly I'm getting back into it.
When I started reading and planning character creation for my inquisitor, I was straight away drawn to the more radical section of inquisitors (xanthites) and i really like the idea of developing an inquisitor character (called 'something' Shannow....terrible with first names but a big fan of Jon Shannow in the Gemmell books) that is convinced of his path yet hunted by his more puritanical comrades.
With this in mind I was also browsing 54mm and 28mm minis as I want to make a version of each. In my search I came across
http://www.coolminiornot.com/shop/miniatures/andrea-miniatures/andrea-miniatures-54mm/leogante-wings-of-redemption-54mm.html
and loved the look of it and the idea of making an inquisitor out of it. I was wondering how well or badly received the wings would be in a game by more experienced players of the game?
My general idea was that in terms of flight they were defunct, and were a mutation by-product caused by over exposure to some chaos/warp/xeno relic that Shannow had been tampering with in order to unlock its power to aid the imperium. I was going to give him the acrobatic skill to represent that they allowed him to be slightly lighter on his feet cushioning falls etc, and due to there size and unearthly origin they allowed him the protection of approximately flak armour levels.
In terms of character I was thinking of a ruthless, decadent (in terms of luxury of living) man with a high level of sophistication and patience but once he had lost said patience became irrational in his fury. I also see him as a man that would use any and all means to achieve his end but preferred to make himself known after his companions had done the research work and only appear for the final mission/fight scenario.
In terms of combat I have him billed as very sword competent (first strike or fast reflexes?), but generally finding guns disdainful methods (though maybe equip with one pistol/xeno pistol?) and lacking in a certain level of honour (but only if he used them, he is perfectly happy to have his companion snipe from afar). Again due to his more radical beliefs I would want to give him 1 or 2 pysker powers, probably one from pyromancy as a definite and possibly one along the lines of telepathic control.
Thats sort of all I've come up with for the moment, just wondering what the background sounds like as a starting point and also how viable the wings would be on a character; I love the model aside from the wings so would probably by and just not have the wings (maybe make into a hat for myself, to wear in games or 40k matches....)
Thanks for reading this far and I'm sorry if its all a load of tosh and boring!
Rob
Ps I did originally post this in the wrong place, sorry about that!
There are rules for winged characters in the Alien Generator article - you'll find it by looking at the 'Inquisitor PDFs' thread.
The thing about close-combat being honourable and not using ranged weapons is a bit of a cliche, but the rest looks like a pretty good starting point - although I generally prefer to see characters with psychic powers from just one discipline.
Oh, and
Welcome to the Conclave
Haha thanks for the welcome,
Now you mention it it is a tad cliched :P and thanks for the pointer on PDF's I haven't had a full browse yet, in the middle of my exams sadly! I'll post some more stuff when I get round to writing an in depth character description etc.
Rob
Right, I've just downloaded and speed-read the alien generator and rules. Even though the rule are designed for rouge traders and bounty hunters, would it be ok to apply the rules to my inquisitor? Just want to be absolutely sure is all, sorry for the retentiveness...
Rob
Quote from: Shannow on May 22, 2010, 09:45:26 AM
would it be ok to apply the rules to my inquisitor? Just want to be absolutely sure is all, sorry for the retentiveness...
Rob
Of course; with Inquisitor it's possible to bend the rules as much as you want as long as it fits the character... just don't go too overboard.
Also, I'm going to go with Kaled on the multi-discipline psychic powers, although if you really want something from pyromancy too you could just give him a Telepathy power and a Daemon weapon with Fiery Blast - it suits his whole Radical theme, too.
That said, he's your character, design him any way you want.
Any plans for the rest of his warband (if he's going to have one)?
To clarify - I don't mind characters having a major focus on one discipline with just a minor power from another (so a pyromancer who can speak telepathically to his minions is okay by me), but I'm less keen on a character who is capable of performing high-end powers from two disciplines.
As for using alien generator rules for an Inquisitor - sure, go for it. A good model makes up for a multitude of sins in my opinion - back it up with some nice background and you're on to a winner.
Ok I've done a bit more thinking and writing (at the expense of revision...I'm sure those exams will go just fine.... ::)) and the background so far ive come up with is:
Inquisitor Maximilian Shannow: Shannow was born and raised on the planet Nocturna-Solaris, so called as due to its lack of axial spin, one half of the planet was permanently in darkness and the other in light. This leading to a population of extreme opposites, half dark skinned with small almost entirely white eyes and the other pale skinned with large obsidian pupil dominated eyes to accommodate for the general lack of light, not even compensated for by the aged globe spheres used to light there homes. Shannow was born to the latter population though at an extreme paleness even for them with almost translucent skin. This too was mirrored in his hair though in years to come he would dye it black to enhance the contrast with his skin which along with other acquired traits would prove useful in present a more terrifying visage.
In a desperate bid to escape his treacherous home world he took work aboard the trade ship Nordican under Captain Salence at the age of 19. The good captain in the following years tutored Shannow in the mastery of the blade himself being an expert with the rapier though Shannow held more potential in heavier blades. He would also provide shannow with his first exposure to the world of xenon technology. As it happened the Nordican was a ship with usually less than legal cargo as Salence traded with many different races including the kroot, eldar rangers far from their craftworlds and very occasionally the technology of their darker cousins; though generally this occurred when they had need of less savoury cargo the captain had acquired.
It was the discovery of the cargo and the captains intention that led the now 25 year old shannow to give him up to the ordo xenos, an act which earned him a place as an explicator under the watchful and learned gaze of Inquisitor Erebus. Under him it was discovered he had an undeveloped talent as a psyker; his quick learning and the fervour with which he applied himself to the study set quickly earned him promotion to interrogator. It was with some mirth that shannow regarded his talent, as given the hemisphere of his origin, it was somewhat ironic that he a fantastic talent for pyromancy. After more than a decade of treacherous escapades since obtaining the rank of interrogator he was finally promoted to full inquisitor of the ordo xenos.
Some of the names and stuff I think are pretty shoddy but I'm terrible at this sort of stuff so be nice:P also unsure about giving up Salence xeno, my thoughts being that he loves xeno tech but not at expense of human slave trade (though not even sure that fits with dark eldar style possibilities).
Thanks for the points on the powers, I think that I'll probably go a couple of pyromancy powers (though have plenty of time to fiddle before playing anyway), was thinking blinding flash and firestorm. Daemon sword was a good idea but I want to concentrate any different equipment as being Xeno as that is his order and obsession.
As for companions, I was thinking of a rogue trader that had become a follower after spending years supplying him with illegally procured xeno stuff (maybe attach a story to a bit of his equipment) but aside from that not really thought of another unless he associates himself with an eldar ranger or xeno/regular bounty hunter for some reason. It'll all come together.
Thanks again for all the stuff, been a very nice welcome :)
Rob
Also was just flicking through the 'where people live' section and noticed you were from the north west kaled, whereabouts? i study at bristol but I live in Lancaster during my holidays and most of my family live/work in Preston. Just curious anyhoo.
Rob
I live in Preston - if you fancy a game during the holidays then I'm sure we can arrange something...
That sounds like a plan...I'm aiming to have at least the inquisitor completed by mid-late july but depends heavily on cash flow....its horrible when I equate how many models/paints etc I could buy for one textbook (£80!!!). Will definitely take you up on that though if possible.
I'll echo Kaled with a welcome - a model you like is always a good palce to start and wings are a nice change from bionics or possession.
However, your fluff/background dosn't really explain how he ended up with them - what relic (and what happened to it?) was he tampering with? I could see a warp/chaos exposure resulting in something like that, but it is quite a 'specific' mutation - perhaps (for example) after a warp breach/summoning failure, he was falling through a void as some daemonic plaything and was 'gifted' them.
A lot of people are going to view him as obviously tainted and/or a mutant as they make him stick out a fair bit; so how does he cope with that? Can he fold them up under a cloak, does he have to prominantly display his Inquisitorial credentials, if he has telepathic powers, can he force people to ignore them/blank them from peoples minds/memories??
Undeveloped psychic talent - humm....not sure he'd make it to 25 without that sort of thing cropping up or being noticed by someone/something earlier (black ships...). Maybe his new found mental powers were connected with his growing/gaining wings?
Dont forget the Inquisition work very much in the shadows, and even if anyone ever heard of them, or knew who/where/how to find them - no one in their right mind is going to try and contact them about something' they have been associated with for a year or two but now have cold feet about, and the wings? oh, well, nothing dodgy about them, honest'
Honest, Im not tyring to sound negative, there is definately potential for something different here! Im looking forward to seeing how this develops.
Sympathise with the student budget problems - but surely the really essential text books are in the library - go on, crank up that overdraft!
Disclaimer: I am not, or ever have been, employed, affliated or otherwise contractually conected with any financial institution in any capacity other than as a debtor
@ Flinty: I see all the points your making and I've been trying to fit bits of story together during my frequent procrastination from revision :P and have written a few expanded version; the one above was just to get feedback and suggestion like yours.
I was going to go for a Ordo Xenos and relate an alien artifact to the mutation, one idea was a warp fuelled genetic modifier sort of like a fully integral form of a Callidus Assassins Poly suit, and the tampering with it resulted in the wing growth. he was aiming for greatly enhanced physical and mental power but couldnt read it properly ;D, also thought this might be a basis to give him regeneration as a residue of the growth capacity of the device? Not sure what you'll make of that. I was leaning to the xenos area because I think it provides a good basis for procuring xenos weapons, however having mulled over it I think Malleus might be easier fluff wise (as per your suggestion sort of thing).
In terms of him hiding his wings, I was leaning more to the point of him being so radical that he was termed hereticus, partly because it would be a good storyline basis i think and makes the lack of concealment less of a problem. But he looks pretty freaky anyway! I like the idea of the telepathic shrouding effect, maybe making it look like a cloak? I was keen on pyromancy but as suggested I could have a couple of telepathic powers and have a daemon weapon, which would also push me further to malleus.
Dont worry about the critique, I didn't take it negatively in the slightest :) I really want to get this right so any and all help is welcomed.
In terms of finance I have just been given a credit card by lloyds...its so damn tempting! But I have a job iinterview next tuesday so hopefully....(rubs hands gleefully) I'll post one of the longer back stories maybe tomorrow
If anyone remembers the old tv show Gargoyles, they used to be able to fold their wings over like a cloak in order to hide them, they almost past for humans too. You could steal that idea and have it that people have to pass a Sagacity test with a -20%, if they pass they see him for what he is, if they don't, he just looks like he's wearing a particularly fabulous coat.
Also, i don't see a problem with him being a mutant, and an Inquisitor with a particular fascination with Sanguinius who's looking for children with that particular mutation (aptly named Homo-Sanguine), and raising them in his own school (ala X-Men, albeit a little more sinister, or even like the G-Men from The Boys, only minus the child rape). That is if you want to take the Inquisitorial route, I was going to go with him being a Mutant who's been captured and fights as a Gladiator, and one of my characters won him in a bet/took the best two as a form of payment becuase their previous owner couldn't afford it. For pretty much the same reasons as you, that is a beautiful model.
Why not make them bionic implants, a way for the radical to mask is activities by appearing like an angelic avenger of the Emperor?
It would only take a little GS and some extra kit on his back to make it into an effect jump pack
@ JoelMcKickass, I didn't want to make him a mutant because I couldn't really see a mutant becoming an inquisitor even with a link to such a prestigious character. But I am going to go with the fact that the wings looks like a cloak, though I will probably make it a willpower test because I think telepathic shrouding of his wings will be easier to apply to lots of scenarios, such as if a character see's him jump pr fly between levels the wings would have to be unfurled and so couldn't look like a coat, even someone who was a bit thick could see that, but if mentally shrouded may just look like a flowing cloak and a good jump.
@ Necris, I did consider bionic implants but I can't tear myself away from their organic nature:P
Also looking at the alien generator rules it gives movement speeds for wings but doesn't mention wound allocation, which seems a bit silly given their size and that he still has legs to use if he needed. I was thinking using the table they give for quadruped creatures to represent the chance of hitting the wings, maybe decrease the chance for characters shooting at him that hadn't already passed a Wp test to see if he had wings? or is that complicating things too much?
Once again thanks for all help and ideas from you guys, this is making it a lot easier!
Quote from: Shannow on May 23, 2010, 06:04:26 PMAlso looking at the alien generator rules it gives movement speeds for wings but doesn't mention wound allocation, which seems a bit silly given their size and that he still has legs to use if he needed.
Wings are large, but don't forget, most of that is feathers, not actual flesh and blood. The bone and muscle structure of a bird's wing is... well, basically that of an arm.
(http://www.biology-resources.com/images/bird-wing-structure-big.jpg)
However, I have a better suggestion than what they did in the Aliens article. Messing with the hit location table means you have to learn a completely new table, and that's just extra work in game.
I wouldn't modify it at all. However, any attack that misses by 20% or less and isn't an auto-miss hits his wings instead. 25% chance of hitting the flesh and blood part of the wings - if not, it hits the feathered parts.
Both parts share the same injury table, but a hit on the feathered parts doesn't contribute to injury total, and has something of a resistance (along the lines of the Invulnerable/Impervious daemonic skills) to certain kinds of attack. Bullets for example, will only poke fairly minor holes through the feathers (so double toughness against solid projectile weapons), but things like bladed weapons or flames will hack/burn away quite large areas (half toughness against blades or heat based weapons).
The extra size added by his wings gets represented by that (without him becoming a total injury total magnet), you don't need to learn an extra location table, and it represents the structure of a wing reasonably.
@ Marcoskoll, brilliant idea I think that'll be the mechanism I use. Won't be playing a game for a while as still have to finish character and models etc but will report back when I've tried this out but seems pretty damn good :)
Also I think in terms of back story I'll probably make him a Malleus Inquisitor and work up some story of fought of daemonic possession or warp battle that bestowed his wings unto him. That and it means I can more legitimately give him a daemonic weapon if I choose too :P
Thanks again
Right, I've written another draft of backstory, this time from the perspective of being from the Ordo Malleus, having looked at who I want him to be I realised the Xeno association was not really that much of an issue. It is a fair bit so I whole heartedly don't mind if you don't read it. But if your interested in the wings bit, its only the last chunky paragraph (number 5) :p i haven't made any further mention of the daemon sword but plan to write at some point that he keeps it hidden as though it is useful he fears it. i might then make rules for when he uses it that he has a penalty to his willpower.
Inquisitor Maximilian Shannow: Shannow was born and raised on the planet Nocturna-Solaris, so called as due to its lack of axial spin, one half of the planet was permanently in darkness and the other in light. This leading to a population of extreme opposites, half dark skinned with small almost entirely white eyes and the other pale skinned with large obsidian pupil dominated eyes to accommodate for the general lack of light, not even compensated for by the aged globe spheres used to light there homes. Shannow was born to the latter population though at an extreme paleness even for them with almost translucent skin. This too was mirrored in his hair though in years to come he would dye it black to enhance the contrast with his skin, which along with other acquired traits would prove useful in present a more terrifying visage.
His discovery by Inquisitor Erebus of the Ordo Malleus was precipitated by a psychic scream that the Astropath aboard Erebus' ship picked whilst in close proximity to his home world and which was accompanied with a profound pain so said the Astropath. On the surface of Nocturna-Solaris they found the pale skinned teenager weeping in a village, surrounded by the bodies of the townsfolk who had been killed by the uncontrolled blast of power, a small number of these however clearly possessed the mark of daemon worship; either in the form of a hidden brand or gruesome 'gift' of chaos. After much questioning, little answering and examination for taint, Erebus concluded the child had in all possibility reacted to a daemon worshipper revealing themselves in an attempt to kidnap the young Shannow with his powers and thus declared him clean and recruited into his service and therefore that of the Emperor.
The psychic talents of Shannow were well tutored by the hand of Erebus; though lacking the strength of power that he had clearly been capable on Nocturna-Solaris he was nevertheless an extremely competent telepath(telekinetic? am unsure). Aside from these his rigours included much training for the combat that would come when his master declared him old enough and well enough for the rank of Interrogator, he proved an exceptional swordsman and a more than able marksman though his greatest competency certainly lay with small pistol firearms and was less keen on the bulky rifles he practiced with.
At the age of 57 he attained the rank of Inquisitor with much support and enthusiasm of Erebus, who gifted him a pair of exquisite revolvers from his own personal collection that he knew Shannow (or Maximilian as he now regarded him) had much coveted. With swift progression Inquisitor Shannow rose in the esteem of the Holy Inquisition, purging many cults and twisted devils. However as his activity became more secretive many began to suspect that he was devoting perhaps too much time to the study of the forces his enemy employed and becoming less interested in their unfaltering destruction. They were, to the sadness of many to prove right in their whisperings.
In the 112th year of his life whilst attempting to bind a daemon to his service (a foolish and danger fraught process for any Inquisitor, let alone one as relatively young as Shannow) in the prison of his sword, he became possessed by the lesser daemon known as Vivaldus. It was only through great strength of mind and body that he fought of this demon and managed finally to challenge its corrupting essence into the dark metal prison as was intended. However Vivaldus as was his nature has the last laugh; the strength and concentration required to simultaneously bind the daemon to his weapon and hold back his presence had allowed a small opening through which Vivaldus had cursed Shannow to be forever known as tainted. As Shannow arose from his arduous task, large wings, 30ft across spread from his back and he wept. However might he try, he could not bring himself to remove the wings or to have them removed; he was bound by some infernal curse to have and protect them till his death.
Naturally this has led many to call for Shannow to be declared Hereticus. He has not been declared so, due only to the favour of his previous master Erebus, whom in such a position of influence had held the forces that be. This did not however prevent many forming their own vendettas against him and the number of Inquisitors that rank against him is many.
Inquisitor Maximilian Shannow, a cursed man, but devout still in all ways to his Emperor, he treads the fine line between defeating and joining the ranks of the enemy.
Quote from: Shannow on May 23, 2010, 09:39:36 PM@ Marcoskoll, brilliant idea I think that'll be the mechanism I use.
It might need a little adjustment. There are a couple of oddities that might arise if a shot is very unlikely to hit - perhaps making it "equal to the hit chance or 20%, whichever is lower", so it doesn't end up being that when there's a 10% normal hit chance, they're twice as likely to hit his wings as him.
But the GM should be able to wing things (pun intended) a bit if it ever ends up really odd, and it'll save on needing a completely unique hit location table.
While I love Inquisitor's potential for detail and accuracy, it's more important to keep things moving. A game bogging down, running out of time or just not having enough explosions in it is far more likely to kill the mood than something not being completely accurate to the real world. (And let's face it, he has wings. He's not exactly accurate to the real world anyway.)
Thank again, I'm really looking forward to playing my first game in the close future hopefully. And I have wings...... Chicken Wings! mmm KFC
Chaos, as a rule, tends to be lest perfect with its 'gifts', normally such blessing take the form of vestigial or malformed wings. I echo Necris's idea, indeed there was once another winged inquisitor on the old (old) board, and her wings were a simulacra over a bionic endo skeleton, similar to those used on Cherubim.
Point taken and well made Macabre. As regards bionic wings, I know they work practically and are easy fluff wise, but I'd like the wings to be a physical example of his extreme radicalism that many of his fellow Inquisitors find repulsive. Any ideas on other ways to fit that well into a backstory. As a slight modification, I did note that Shannow left but a small opening in his will, perhaps I could make more of this battle of willpower and say that though the daemon Vivaldus was able to manipulate Shannow's physical form, the mutating power was still restricted/controlled/proportioned by Shannow? Not sure how much I'm hanging by my fingertips there ::) feel free to chastise me appropriately:P
I'm surprised i'm the first to mention this; perhaps it's the elephant in the room that everyone is ignoring for one reason or another, but if humans had wings they still couldn't fly. We would need essentially hollow bones, such as those that birds have. Even with a huge wingspan, we would be too heavy. As far as my understanding goes (and i'm no scientist, but i've come accross these sorts of discussions before), just growing wings does not give one the ability to fly.
However, i suppose it could be argued that if the wings are stuff of the warp, they have the ability to fly as a sort of supernormal property, but if they are just feathers and bones, with no supernatural properties, then the problem still arises. Therefore, I agree with the suggestion that they should be bionic. if they were bionics, then they could feasible be argued to facilitate flight because in an age with anti-grav technology, advanced thruster propulsion etc... mechanical wings that bestow flight are just as beleivable as, for example, jump packs.
Anyway, perhaps there is a reason no one brought up the inability to fly so far, if so, feel free to tell me why, but to me, if we are considering some semblence of realism (and yes i know we are talking about a man with wings, but suspense of disbelief only gets you so far), surely simply growing ordinary wings does not facilitate flight?
@ Brother_Brimstone, As mentioned above I wanted the wings to be a representative of his radicalism by them being spawned by daemonic or xenos origin, so yeah I was going for what you suggested which was that of the flight not strictly based on the physiology but more the wings latent power be it daemon or xenos. Again I see the point of bionics but I really would rather find a fluff kosher way of avoiding them if possible, they just don't appeal to me as an aesthetic or as an aspect of his personality i.e. if i knew someone who purposefully had jump wings designed it smack of self righteousness/puritanicalness etc (though that is just my take on it obviously)
Quote from: Brother_Brimstone on May 24, 2010, 01:18:34 PMPerhaps it's the elephant in the room that everyone is ignoring for one reason or another, but if humans had wings they still couldn't fly.
I'm fully aware of that. But some elephants need to be ignored - winged humans are an archetype in fantasy, and even if it shouldn't work, it's usually taken as being within the realms of suspension of disbelief.
Anyway, the problem isn't so much weight (hollow bones wouldn't actually reduce a human's weight all that much) - but power. The muscle structure of birds is built with huge power in the chest - that is to say, that the muscle mass of a human is distributed wrong for flight.
The human's muscle distribution puts a LOT of muscle in the legs - as bipedalism is our primary method of locomotion, it's hardly surprising.
Quote from: Shannow on May 24, 2010, 12:06:20 PMAny ideas on other ways to fit that well into a backstory.
If it's something that's supposed to have happened by accident, as opposed to being a deliberate choice, or something he's had since birth - it's quite hard to find a reason it would happen.
Actually come to think of it, I suppose it needn't be an accident, just in some way linked to his radicalism. So I suppose deliberate organogenesis of wings through means most wicked would do..
Someone just said to me 'subject to gravity and atmospheric conditions' for ability to fly, which I suppose is true enough. It occurs to me that they could be of use even if full flight isn't possible, in gliding down distances or even for speed when running / gliding (some research on quails suggests they gain speed by flapping their wings while running, IIRC).
While the imperium does have major genetic engineering capabilities (ref. space marines), the use of it is extremely restricted and marked deviation from the 'human' genotype would be seen as heretical, certainly as a radical act.
It doesn't seem entirely impossible that he mutated to gain creepy chaos wings and then beautified them of his own accord.
Once again I really have to thank everyone for their contributions and criticisms its all been very helpful:) I've decided that the wings would be a deliberately cultured mutation using a daemonic artifact called the Ataxium Telangiectasium (which if your interested is a medical condition with -um added on the end:p). This wasn't meant to be permanent, just a dabble into the use of chaos to heal, create, prolong etc but he lacked sufficient prowess knowledge to make it reversible.
I would write more on this but I have just hit the main lump of my exams so I am fairly swamped, I will try to get something more concrete done, but I'm fairly happy with most of his story I think. Anyone had chance to read it fully? Also I have a job interview in 45 minutes so hopefully will be able to crack on with more models soon (fingers crossed!)
Thanks again
Rob