Author Topic: The Ordo Chronos  (Read 9931 times)

Offline MarcoSkoll

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #15 on: April 28, 2011, 01:10:51 PM »
I think that there we have reached the center of our disagreeing, the number of inquisitors in a region of space at the same point in time.
And it's clearly enough that a system based around Ordos is not only existent, but commonplace.

There might be the odd sector that is an oddity in that is sparse and safe enough it only needs ten Inquisitors to deal with any possible threats, and thus might do without threat specific Ordos (although would likely have a general purpose sector Ordo for the sake of collaboration), but I dare say these sectors are not numerous enough to justify the statement to the effect of "most Inquisitors wouldn't join an Ordo" you made earlier.
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Offline Dolnikan

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2011, 01:17:16 PM »
I think that most sectors wouldn't have many inquisitors, there of course wouldn't be enough but that, at least in my mind, seems fitting for the setting. If there would be enough inquisitors operational large-scale rebellions as do frequently occur would be far harder to organize and nearly nonexistent.

These inquisitors could of course organize themselves but it would not be one of the big named ones.

The fluff focuses on the most important sectors where most inquisitors would be, the largest part of the imperium would be backwater sectors without such a massive inquisitorial presence.
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Offline Kaled

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2011, 01:37:17 PM »
I'm still not sure how you've reached that conclusion. Every sector is really on the frontier of Imperial space in some way - the Imperium controls a miniscule proportion of the galaxy but is spread thinly across its entire span. Alien empires rise and fall often unnoticed by the Imperium even though they're technically within it's borders so the threat from xenos is ever present even when it's not on the scale of a massive war. Witchcraft and uncontrolled psykers appear on every world, the minions of chaos are ever ready to move against the Imperium. The threats faced by th Inquisition are not restricted to key sectors and frontier worlds - they're everywhere. The magnitude of the threat will differ and so some Ordos will have a bigger or smaller presence in some sectors, but, like the threats it faces, the Inquisition is everywhere. Some sectors may just have a hamdful of actual Inquisitors but they would seem to be the exception not the norm.
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Offline Dolnikan

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2011, 02:00:34 PM »
The threats faced by the inquisition are not faced only by key worlds but efforts do focus on them, many worlds can leave the fol without being noticed, this implies that the inquisition isn't present there. Inquisitors also aren't needed for most threats. The inquisitor only directly faces the gravest threats, most cults will be rooted out without their direct involvement, the same goes for witchcraft and xenos activity. The inquisition only comes into play when lower levels of authority cannot find or destroy the threat. But I guess all this depends on how one looks at the setting.
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Offline Ulgavitch

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2011, 02:14:51 PM »
Quote
The threats faced by the inquisition are not faced only by key worlds but efforts do focus on them, many worlds can leave the fol without being noticed, this implies that the inquisition isn't present there. Inquisitors also aren't needed for most threats. The inquisitor only directly faces the gravest threats, most cults will be rooted out without their direct involvement, the same goes for witchcraft and xenos activity. The inquisition only comes into play when lower levels of authority cannot find or destroy the threat.

I beg to differ. The Inquisition is involved in what-ever takes its fancy or interest, that's sort of the point. There isn't a hierarchy of threats which the Inquisition ignores, as even the lowliest cult can be incredible dangerous. A committed four or five man cult could summon a daemon to destroy a world much easier than a two hundred man cult, because they are smaller. The Inquisition has to keep an eye on all of this.

The other thing to note is that the Inquisition controls knowledge as well as threats. The three Ordos Majoris don't just protect the fabric of the Imperium, but it's people from information which would warp their minds. You don't send Arbites or PDF troops un-supervised to clean up a cult, because who knows what they will discover? The threat might then spread further through those 'new' minds. 

You need the trust in and suspicion of an Inquisitor to make sure that the threat is destroyed safely. Even if it then means having the PDF soldiers who cleared up the cult killed so they tell no-one either...

 

Offline Dolnikan

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #20 on: April 28, 2011, 02:36:49 PM »
I think that most threats would be removed by groups which I perhaps wrongly called lower. An inquisitor would only deal personally with the most important affairs, the rest he or she would leave to underlings, most small cults would be cleaned up by these lower organizations, they would just be rounded up and executed, this of course presents the risk. The problem you point to, of small, dedicated cults is indeed a great danger, however, even when inquisitors try to look into it they won't find such small cults unless they do something stupid. It is the same problem as we have in the real world, loners or very small groups can and will remain undetected if they are careful.

I must however say that I had completely forgotten about suppressing the knowledge. It would take either the inquisitor or more commonly one of his subordinates to deal with that.
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Offline Kaled

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #21 on: April 28, 2011, 03:36:17 PM »
An Inquisitor would only deal personally with the most important affairs, but that doesn't mean the rest are dealt with by 'lower' organisations - every Inquisitor heads a large organisation of agents (both knowing and unknowing), informants, cells of acolytes etc all of whom work to combat threats to the Imperium. They may not be Inquisitors but they are still the Inquisition. Even if a sector did only have a dozen Inquisitors it would still have many thousands of Inquisitorial agents working to root out heresy in all its forms. The sector conclave would be small in terms of number of Inquisitors but could still have pooled massive resources they could draw on in times of need.
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Offline Dolnikan

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #22 on: April 28, 2011, 03:58:08 PM »
Well then, I think we agree. A large part of the rest will be dealt with by underlings, including unknowing ones who will often be part of those lower organizations.
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Offline Ulgavitch

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #23 on: April 28, 2011, 04:31:04 PM »
Quote
Well then, I think we agree. A large part of the rest will be dealt with by underlings, including unknowing ones who will often be part of those lower organizations.


It always reminds me of how manipulative an Inquisitor has to be. I occasionally forget, while they are doing all their action heroics, that they always are the center of their own spy ring and networks. Their greatest weapons (at the risk of sounding cliched) are the other people doing their bidding.

So, yes, if you mean by lower parts, it could be other inquisitorial agents knowing or unknowing. We agree. They must have been carefully selected, however, because the protection of knowledge is important regardless.

Offline Flinty

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #24 on: April 29, 2011, 09:35:23 AM »
A useful analogy for the Inquisition might be the modern Intelligence services of any country. They each have thier own structures and hierarchies and areas of interest. Sometimes, several agencies may take an interest in the same area, event or individual; they might co-operate, sometimes they will have divergent or conflicting aims. Each branch or arm will have its own, and sometimes shared, support and logistics functions; and presumably each will maintain its own level of secrecy with regards to other branches.

The unifiying factor is that they are all (in a multitude of ways and with degrees of success) working towards a shared goal of national security, be it internal or external, abd in the Imperium, without.

 
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Offline Dolnikan

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #25 on: April 29, 2011, 11:39:26 AM »
A useful analogy for the Inquisition might be the modern Intelligence services of any country. They each have thier own structures and hierarchies and areas of interest. Sometimes, several agencies may take an interest in the same area, event or individual; they might co-operate, sometimes they will have divergent or conflicting aims. Each branch or arm will have its own, and sometimes shared, support and logistics functions; and presumably each will maintain its own level of secrecy with regards to other branches.

The unifiying factor is that they are all (in a multitude of ways and with degrees of success) working towards a shared goal of national security, be it internal or external, abd in the Imperium, without.

 

That indeed is a very useful analogy, I personally would consider each inquisitor to be a separate branch, ordos would then be cooperation groups of a bunch of branches.
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Offline Inquisitor Dionzi

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #26 on: May 26, 2011, 06:27:22 PM »
That's a good point - remember that the presence of an Ordo in a specific area is referred to as an Ordos - a subsidiary bureaucratic establishment that can 1) administer/oversee the entirety (sorta) of Inquisitorial efforts in the sector across all three Ordos, or 2) be a specific field office for an Ordo in the sector.

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Offline Easy E

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #27 on: June 16, 2011, 07:46:55 PM »
So, do people change Ordos?

Fro example, Eisenhorn is an Ordo Xeno at first, but that doesn't stop him getting involved with Demonhost's and such.  At some point in his career, as he encountered more and more of such creatures could he choose or petition or something to switch to the Ordo Malleus? 

Related, can people formally sever ties with their Ordos to go free agent? 
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Offline MarcoSkoll

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #28 on: June 16, 2011, 09:04:27 PM »
At some point in his career, as he encountered more and more of such creatures could he choose or petition or something to switch to the Ordo Malleus?
If we're using Eisenhorn as an example, there is another Inquisitor who changes Ordos (I forget his name - it comes up near the end of the second book). So yes.

Quote
Related, can people formally sever ties with their Ordos to go free agent?
Yes, but why they would want to is another matter.

The Inquisition in the Eisenhorn books is very bureaucratic, quite unlike the normality of the Inquisition (the sector is apparently "special"). For the most part, an Inquisitor's Ordo won't bother him, nor he it. So you can basically consider about any Inquisitor a "free agent", even if part of an Ordo.

However, those pooled resources are very useful if you need them.
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Offline Molotov

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Re: The Ordo Chronos
« Reply #29 on: June 16, 2011, 09:28:33 PM »
From memory it's Titus Endor, who is coerced into changing Ordos.
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