Inquisitor Grand Tournament 2013 - 30/03/2013

[MarcoSkoll]

Or, more radically, the change the rules for the IGT so, much like with terrain, there's no guarantees which scale you'll have to GM for.

After our earlier suggestions of "you could bring two different scales" managed to turn into "You should really have 54mm models", I don't think this is at all good as an idea.

It means that attendees have to write scenarios with an even narrower set of criteria or have all their resources on hand for both scales. And a lot of people won't want to do that, at least at this stage.

The former - well, an NPC or two in a scenario often adds flavour. I fear that if everyone had to write their scenarios as to be able to play at both scales, we'd see less interesting ideas.

The latter is, aside from being more (and quite possibly wasted) work, biased in favour of 54mm players, I feel.
As quite a lot of 54mm players have 40k or Necromunda experience, there are probably more than a few who could dig out roughly equivalent NPC squads - a IG squad, a hive gang, etc - for both scales. Perhaps even matching vehicles.
There aren't, however, going to be many 28mm players with a 54mm thug squad on hand. So this does mean that 54mm players will have at least some advantage.

It's one matter if people can choose to GM at either scale, but we definitely don't want to be forcing people to. As Charax says, this is a recipe for resentment, not unity. And likely a lot of "Sorry, don't want to come this year".

Moving on to the question of a poll, I think this might be counter productive at the moment.
As I said on Ammobunker, I think the current issues are quite heavily defined by how little the two groups know each other and how they play. We don't want to be cementing opinions just yet, so I think we should be looking at these issues later - at least after Kaled and I have been to the INQvitational, but ideally after (if it can be done) a dual-scale event.

[Heroka Vendile]

I agree with what I think MarcoSkoll is saying here, that we should basically pause any further discussion of developing the IGT until such a time as at least one "non-competitive" dual-scale event has occurred.

I do stand by my IGT "Grand Master" suggestion however as the best first step before possibly integrating further in the future.

[RobSkib]

There aren't, however, going to be many 28mm players with a 54mm thug squad on hand. So this does mean that 54mm players will have at least some advantage.

I know some others have offered their services in the past, so I'll speak for myself here. I have more 54mm goons than I know what to do with - if I'm attending an event, there's no reason why people can't rifle through my model case for the mooks they need.

I think the current issues are quite heavily defined by how little the two groups know each other and how they play.

"Be the change you want to see in the world."

I'll be signing up to Ammobunker and miniaturising some of my favourite 54mm characters over the summer.

[MarcoSkoll]

I should say that the first (and only, so far) response I've had on Ammobunker to trying to iron out any creases by "testing" the GT scoring at a non-competitive day has been positive.

I know some others have offered their services in the past

It's a bit different between a friendly and a scored setting. The idea that it's not all their own work and that that might affect how people score them might put some people off.

In any case, I doubt we want to be going too radical with our first mixed GT, lest we end up with it being declared Excommunicate Traitoris as a result.

[Koval]

Then go with the test-at-another-event suggestion. There's a massive gap of eleven months between now and when you want IGT'13 to happen, which is enough time to run a fair number of mixed events and hammer things out left right and centre.

[MarcoSkoll]

In practice, there's maybe a six month window. We want to have the plans for the GT sorted at least a couple of months in advance, organising another event would take about the same... add in some leeway and a reasonable amount of time between events, I doubt we'll have more than two events in the time. And I think we can only count on one of those being a test bed.

And just because one person has taken it well doesn't necessarily mean that everyone will.

[Koval]

Okay, so maybe in practice it's less time than I imagined, but six months is still a long time in which you can do some testing. Maybe you'll also be able to stimulate some sort of civil discussion about it with other people, in person rather than on a forum. You won't know if you don't try.

[Keravin]

To be honest as one of the others that straddles between the two sites I don't see much antagonism at all from the INQ28 crowd on scale or much else.

[RobSkib]

It's just like racism. Nothing is racist until someone says "Hang on, isn't that racist?".

Can we get a definitive list of which events are being planned by which people? There's obviously the IGT '13, but there's talk of what, at least 3 different events being rumoured to happen before then. Who is running what?

[Van Helser]

*Krenshar has suggested in the Dual Scale Event thread that separating the Painting and Modelling round from the main scoring and having a competition for each scale instead.  I'm just adding this here to get some feedback on that idea.*

As for the last couple of comments in this thread:

A poll sounds like a good idea, but I have one dunder-headed question: how do I set one up on this forum?  Can't for the life of me see how to do it!  I could always start a thread with the questions and simply ask people for a set response I suppose.

I think I may head over to Ammobunker and see what the thoughts of the bigger 28mm community are, and at the very least, nudge those chaps towards any poll that appears here.

Although there are 11 months until the next IGT, I would prefer to have all my planning sorted out in advance of that so that the player packs can go out around the time that the date is confirmed (WHW have told me October for a confirmation on the date).  That leaves 6 months for everyone to prepare, plus ample time for publicising the event. 

Ruaridh

[greenstuff_gav]

A poll sounds like a good idea, but I have one dunder-headed question: how do I set one up on this forum?  Can't for the life of me see how to do it!  I could always start a thread with the questions and simply ask people for a set response I supp

Id need to look when i get to a pc if i can start one, but polls are disabled by Saussures order :-P

[MarcoSkoll]

Can we get a definitive list of which events are being planned by which people?

This, as I know it, is the current state of Inquisitor events:

   
• INQvitational - Molotov - 9th June 2012
• Kaede Mack Conspiracy - RobSkib - 15th September 2012
• Dual-scale event - MarcoSkoll - November/December 2012
• IGT - Van Helser - 30th March 2013
• Balanced event - Bloodpact - No date
• Informal meet - Karandras_sh - No date

There's no reason that Karandras' informal meet couldn't also be open to 28mm play, given that it's just a chance to pre-arrange games with people. In fact, if it does happen, I think I would try and get one of my games in at 28mm.

[krenshar]

*Krenshar was a dolt and should have posted his idea here in the first place.*

On scoring for dual-scale, what about running any p&m section as a competition separate from the score?  It would allow for a category -and thus a winner- at each scale, plus it leaves the gaming aspect universal across the event if one assumes that the game is played in the same spirit, no matter a warband's height.

To encourage mixing, players could be expected to score the models of both categories, with the option to abstain from one scale should a player feel too disinterested/inexperienced in that scale.  That way there's no pressure, a model's average score won't be skewed by low scores from players resenting having to score, and it would hopefully lead to discussion and inspiration across the scales.

Granted, that's two more prizes to find than currently but as someone already pointed out, the potential increase in attendance should balance that out.

[Heroka Vendile]

Out of interest, how did the player-scored P&M run this year? Did all players have to score all of the submitted models? Or was it a rank your favourite three setup?

Splitting off the P&M isn't a bad idea, but slightly detracts from the idea that the tournament is about showcasing/rewarding creativity across the whole of the hobby, from playing to GMing to P&M.

I still think the key issue with a single score sheet across both scales is as Stormgrad says, you are competing against players that you have zero chance of actually playing against during the tournament, which just seems wrong at a basic level.

[greenstuff_gav]

P&M you gave each individual model a mark out of 10...

The prob with t "scoring people you wont play against" is that the more who play, the gratrr chance of that anywho... At t gt you should encounter 15 diff people, but im sure i encountered a coupl of peeps twice... either them or myself gming and then facing ingame...... not that im worried as marcos math was great, but tgat issue will occur anytime... atleast we dont place peiple by score in which you woll only face t
same people :-P
typed on t phone so please forgive speelnig!